• neuralRiot 5 months ago

    >"Fundamentally, you can see the 'escape the corset' movement as a challenge to a male-dominated society,"

    I cannot talk about Korean society but usually in my experience women are more critical of other women about beauty standards than men.

  • krapp 5 months ago

    That doesn't contradict the premise that such standards are primarily set by a male-dominant society in order to satisfy the male gaze.

  • neuralRiot 5 months ago

    Perhaps, but I wouldn't see it so much as a male domination phenomenon but as a self pressure to be accepted or liked, males on the other hand have to be successful or wealthy to find a female. We are just one more in the animal kingdom just a bit more complex.

  • krapp 5 months ago

    >Perhaps, but I wouldn't see it so much as a male domination phenomenon but as a self pressure to be accepted or liked

    It can be both, depending on the culture. Standards of beauty don't always arise because women are in control of what society accepts of them, regardless of whether or not women compete within the boundaries society sets for them, or even agree with or reinforce them.

    >males on the other hand have to be successful or wealthy to find a female.

    You would need to employ a very loose definition of "wealthy" or "successful" for this to be true, even if one accepts the premise that all women are looking for in a man is money and power. Many of the men I know who have "found a female" are not particularly wealthy or successful, at least not noticeably more so than the general population. Indeed, the reverse is also true often enough.

  • belorn 5 months ago

    > Many of the men I know who have "found a female" are not particularly wealthy or successful

    We don't need to speculate based on anecdotal evidence, we can just use the data readily available to us. For example, Swedish data where income and family records are public information.

    Within the same age groups, adult males below the 50% income line has twice the risk of being fatherless compared to above the 50% line. The further a male drop in income the lower the chance of having children of their own, and that by a very significant margin.

    >> but I wouldn't see it so much as a male domination phenomenon but as a self pressure to be accepted or liked

    There is an other word for this: social status. Women compete with other women on the social status ladder. This is why women spend more time on beauty if a group has more female members compared to more male members. The more male dominate a group is, the less the standards of beauty is applied.

    Naturally the same apply to men. In a male dominated group you see more male social status competition over wealth and success. Males in female dominated groups do not need to as much.

    In both cases we have to consider that humans are complex and participate in multiple social status groups at the same time and will bleed behavior between them.

  • neuralRiot 5 months ago

    >Many of the men I know who have "found a female" are not particularly wealthy or successful, at least not noticeably more so than the general population.

    It depends of the pool of available males for each female, i also believe that we as animals have become masters of faking our "alpha" status according to the situation. When you observe animal societies you realize that our basic instincts still there, just surrounded by a very complex machinery to reach our goals.

  • krageon 5 months ago

    This is incredibly reductionist. I would love to see some incontrovertible studies done on this phenomenon. Most preferably not by a small group of people. Do you have access to those? Have you found some sort of mostly universal truth in data somewhere?