• alexggordon 9 months ago

    While I know it might be a little hidden, I'd just like to say I'm really glad Will Bond of Package Control[0] was able to join[1] the Sublime Text team. Having first class support for Package Control in ST is definitely one of the features I value the most out of Sublime Text and IMHO one of the things that still keeps it very competitive with Atom other text editors.

    I use packages from ST almost every day and plus I wouldn't have gotten my first job without Will (thanks for hiring me even after seeing all that terrible code I wrote), so I can actually say my life would be a lot different without his influence. I'm really happy he's officially part of the team.

    [0] https://packagecontrol.io/

    [1] https://www.sublimetext.com/blog/articles/sublime-text-3-bui...

  • tombusby 9 months ago

    Speaking of, the GitGutter plugin I use just broke on this update.


    Doesn't even appear in the installable list now. Hopefully he'll get some of these hickups with package manager sorted.

  • wbond 9 months ago

    If it isn't in the installable list, you may have it installed already.

    Package Control is open source and contributions are welcome! We finally get to rip out support for ST2 and Python 2.6 now also!

  • tombusby 9 months ago

    Yeah that was a part of the problem.


    It was still installed... but broken.

  • geoelectric 9 months ago

    Weird, it was the first thing I installed after installing 3.0 as a new install. Wonder if it's an update issue in particular.

  • tombusby 9 months ago

    It's an update issue, I'm talking to a fair few people who had the same issue on a GitHub issue. I have resolved it now.

    This update appears to have broken a lot of plugins.

  • geoelectric 9 months ago

    Sorry, bad wording on my part. By update issue I meant something where you had to have the version already installed prior to updating, vs. a fresh install (which worked for me).

  • wbond 9 months ago

    I don't think ST3 broke anything. More likely Package Control 3.3.0, that was released three days ago, is the issue.

  • karthik248 9 months ago

    Immediately after the update if wasn't working, but restarting sublime seems to have fixed it

  • thecrumb 9 months ago

    Good - he's working on Sublime. Bad - he's neglecting his plugins a bit. Hopefully with 3.0 out the door officially he can balance things out a bit.

  • rhencke 9 months ago

    The Sublime community is blessed to have his work supported in a way that lets him dedicate his time to Sublime Text as fully as he does. Given he one of few people who can work directly on Sublime itself, I am glad his focus is there.

  • lvoudour 9 months ago

    Sublime is probably the first GUI text editor that left me satisfied. Everything else over the years was either non-portable, slow or lacking features. After two months of use I just had to buy it, it's worth the price.

    - It's fast and responsive, can handle large files and personally I've never seen it leaking memory or crashing

    - Love the goto anything and command palette, brilliant

    - Text editing is great and can be easily enhanced with existing plugins

    - Theming is great

    - Project handling is a bit weird, but once you get the hang of it it's fantastic

    I don't do use IDE-like features (auto-complete, linting, compiling, etc.) nor integration features (version control for example) so I can't say how it fares in that aspect.

    Recently I tried VSCode and Atom. They are portable and feature rich out of the box, but God are they slow and memory hungry. I can definitely see the appeal for web devs but it doesn't work for me, I value responsiveness above all else (that's the main reason I avoid dedicated IDEs)

  • musage 9 months ago

    Have you ever seen UltraEdit? I dare you to try the trial, actually go through the exquisite configuration dialogs to make it yours, and then to ever look back :)

    This isn't as a knock on ST, which I also like, and might even sometimes prefer for pure writing or temporary notes. But it doesn't even have printing out of the box, come on. For me that's too modern.. plugins are nice, but I guess I prefer UE to ST like I preferred old Opera to Firefox.

  • shortstuffsushi 9 months ago

    Could you mention what you're likely to be printing? What sort of uses do you have where you write notes in a plain text editor and print them out? I can't think of the last time I printed anything -- actually, I should say I can't think of the last time that I printed anything that wasn't a contract or HR paperwork type of stuff, which is never in plain text. I'm curious what else is still being printed these days. Also, they have plugins for that, if you're interested. You're correct that it's not built in, though.

  • girvo 9 months ago

    I print code reasonably regularly! Makes going through it with a highlighter and red pen to get a sense of what it does and what should be changed quite nice, and it's good to get away from a screen every now and then.

    I mostly do it when I'm examining modules in a codebase I'm unfamiliar with.

  • JohnBooty 9 months ago

    That's interesting to hear. (Since this is the internet, let me be clear: that's not sarcasm)

    Theoretically I really like the idea of reviewing code on paper.

    But typically, if I'm trying to familiarize myself with a codebase, we're talking dozens of files. Usually I'm going through three, four, five levels of code to see how a request is served up, and then my search will fan out sideways into even more files as I attempt to see what other processes in the application might affect the data I'm concerned with.

  • musage 9 months ago

    For example with songs I'm in the process of making, I like to have a list on me with just the titles so I can note down acoustic observations made while listening to them on various speakers or headphones, for the next iteration of "mastering". Or little bits of info for my wallet, e.g. when a handwritten thing gets so old that I want to refresh it, then I'd rather make a printout and stick that in there. I like to make "cheat sheets" too, for work stuff or for all sorts of things, which aren't elaborate enough to warrant desktop publishing efforts, just proportional text. Granted, I don't print a lot, but for me it's still some of the very rudimentary things one might do with text.

  • santaclaus 9 months ago

    > Could you mention what you're likely to be printing?

    To paper? Never. To PDF? I've printed to pdf to get nice looking formatted code for presentations.

    I see print as more a brute force bazooka feature to get nice vector graphics out of apps.

  • provemewrong 9 months ago

    IIRC there's a Sublime plugin (obviously) that supports copy pasting formatted code with syntax highlighting. I definitely remember using it at university. Printing to PDF to get syntax highlighting just sounds like an unnecessary step in between.

  • baby 9 months ago

    What I do:

    * c/p in a gist

    * when looking at the gist, print the page in your browser

    * save to PDF

  • illizian 9 months ago

    You may want to a look at https://github.com/mplewis/src2png (it was popular on here at the beginning of the week https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15220069)

  • thoth 9 months ago

    I switched from UE to ST entirely because of UE's licensing/activation model.

    Maybe it is different now, but UE used to require an internet connection for the registration... or you had to email your info for offline codes.

    I have a bunch of isolated machines at work, physical and virtual, and got tired of dealing with UE and its registration requirements. Especially when ST gave a license key file I could copy around as needed.

    So I switched. But yeah, I remember UE was a really good editor. Now I'm happy with ST.

  • copperx 9 months ago

    I fell in love with UltraEdit about ten years ago, and then I forgot completely about it. It amazes me how "obscure" it is when it's a fantastic replacement for ST, VSCode, Atom, Brackets, and dare I say, even Emacs/Vim.

  • billforsternz 9 months ago

    It always amazes me how Ultraedit is completely invisible on Hacker News. It's been a very decent option for a very long time.

  • lvoudour 9 months ago

    >Have you ever seen UltraEdit?

    A long time ago (>10 years) but then I mostly used IDEs for development. Didn't know it was still out there, I'll may give it another try, thanks

  • Friedduck 9 months ago

    UltraEdit does column editing so much better than ST. I think I prefer ST overall but that one feature, when it's needed, is wonderful.

  • Pamar 9 months ago

    I use it in the office (on Windows) and yes, the column mode is the best I used. I did try the Mac version (of UE) but I think it was still in beta mode and I was not really impressed. But on Windows is really great.

  • bitmapbrother 9 months ago

    I have and switched when I discovered how badly UltraEdit choked on very large files.

  • jamespo 9 months ago

    It's a very good editor; I always assumed it was windows only but it's multiplatform too.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    First: I love ST. It is an amazing software that runs just as good on Mac/Linux/Win. In a pinch I will download and use it and never complain. Python extensibility is also great, since Python is the language I do best.

    That said, and I hate to be this guy (not really), but... Emacs?

    * Performance: Acceptable on modern day

    * Goto Anything: Helm/Projectile, command palette = M-x

    * Text Editing: It is what emacs does best as a program

    * Themes: Yes

    * Project Handling: Projectile

    * IDE Features: These exist

    * Source Control Integration: Many people use emacs purely because of Magit, it is a great git UI that people won't know about in general because it is runs on emacs

    I copy my ~/.emacs.d to a server, literally my whole environment minus some tty nuisances just works. Everything. All my package versions. Emacs is stable enough that not many things break between big versions 23/24/25.

    There are two areas ST wins: Out of the box configuration and performance on very big things. It is true the learning curve to settle all of these features I am mentioning is non-trivial, but Emacs is open source and, like I mentioned, very stable. It has gotten enough right in its initial concept that it will always be a fine environment to mangle up some text in files into whatever you want.

    This brings me to my next point, there is nothing really new under the sun regarding text editing. Atom/VS Code/Eclipse/IntelliJ/Emacs -- you want to edit a bunch of files in a directory structure, navigate quickly and easily between files and get context important information about the code. Everything else is just flavors of those same chores, often specialized to a few programming languages or whatever new things are popular at the time (JavaScript / Can we build an editor in JavaScript).

    I have seen very little innovation in the field of text editing. Light table was interesting, and its no surprise it is very Clojure/Lisp oriented. I am in a giant lisp machine when editing code in emacs, I can whack out a lisp expression anywhere and emacs will faithfully evaluate it for me.

    Next point: If you work in a language or big project you need a way to navigate and generate lots of boiler plate in some languages (Java). IDEs help there, but...

    Final point: The speed with which we write text as programmers is not the limiting factor of how much software we can produce and never has been.

    My conclusion was to invest in one editor that has been around a long time and just not worry too much about it. I can use emacs in 20 years probably. Who knows about atom or vs code or whatever. So it isn't a pro emacs, you should use emacs reply to you, but that over the long run, using the same system to edit text is probably worth it. Stick with one thing and ignore everything else unless you are forced to use some IDE, and even then really try to avoid it. Even then I am pretty sure I could do my job with Gedit or Notepad without much of a productivity hit.

    edit: formatting

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    > there is nothing really new under the sun regarding text editing

    This may be true in for single heroic innovations, but sometimes the 'new' can emerge from successive refinement. I find this to be the case for IntelliJ. Working in it in static languages (at least the ones it knows well) just feels to me quite different from merely 'editing text'. The depth of code intelligence, combined with hundreds of small refinements in the way commands like refactoring work, affords a sense of working with syntax and structure, not 'text'.

    > The speed with which we write text as programmers is not the limiting factor of how much software we can produce and never has been.

    Again what IntelliJ adds for me isn't 'speed', but a cognitive sense of moving up the abstraction hierarchy. I'm thinking in terms of things like 'add a parameter to all call sites' much more than I am editing 'text'.

    (caveat: I did use vim quite extensively many years ago, but never got beyond the learning shortcuts phase with emacs. It's possible either of the big 2 have similar refactoring and code intelligence packages available now)

  • tomjakubowski 9 months ago

    > Working in it in static languages (at least the ones it knows well) just feels to me quite different from merely 'editing text'. The depth of code intelligence, combined with hundreds of small refinements in the way commands like refactoring work, affords a sense of working with syntax and structure, not 'text'.

    These days, out-of-process, editor-agnostic code analysis engines or "language servers" provide many IDE-like features to any text editor that is scriptable and can do basic IPC. Examples include:

    * Tern for Javascript

    * rtags for C and C++ (I use this all day, every day, at work, it's remarkable how good it is)

    * Go's oracle tool

    * racer for Rust

    * tools.nrepl for Clojure

    All of these have solid editor support; at the very least, a good package is available for Vim, Emacs, and Sublime Text.

    IDEs tend to be all or nothing. I'll open one on occasion for a particularly nasty debugging session. I wish, though, that half the development effort going into IDEs were instead directed towards better editor-agnostic tooling.

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    The only one of those I have tried is tern, which didn't come close to IntelliJ's analysis, but obviously Javascript's a harder beast in this respect than Java, kotlin, Objective-C etc.

    > I wish, though, that half the development effort going into IDEs were instead directed towards better editor-agnostic tooling.

    In principle I agree. I like the thought of composable tools. But I wonder in practise. I'm trying to picture the vast array of facilities integrated in IntelliJ (analyses, many refactorings, syntax-aware snippets, amazing code navigation, structural search & replace, data flow anaylysis, syntax-aware select, omnipresent code generation, etc) integrated into a text editor via external tools. I suppose it could be done, but it seems unwieldy. And with how much work (setup and maintenance) on the part of the user? How often would things clash or need fixing? And with how much discoverability (a critical feature of IntelliJ)?

    What I do know is that working with code (not mere text!) in IntelliJ is quite a joy for me. For now, I'm glad someone has built it, even if the 'ultimate' composable set of tools might have some advantages.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    Not everyone has this luxury, but I simply avoid languages that require an IDE to be productive or think abstractly. Alas, not everyone can get away with this. Also, IntelliJ is also a very nice editor. I have used it a decent amount and liked it well enough when editing Java.

  • mickronome 9 months ago

    I've used IntelliJ IDEA since forewer and I can only agree, and add a little bit of my own.

    Having worked extensively with primareliu Java in IDEA, I have come to consider syntax something that is more a presentation layer issue than something actually important to the core differences between languages.

    I suspect that this shift in what I consider important parts of a language is at least partially down to an IDE that for the most part lets me think about the concepts I am expressing, rather than their superficial expression as text on a computer screen.

  • city41 9 months ago

    I agree that finding an open source, well established and powerful editor is an investment worth making. That basically means vim or emacs. Once over the learning curve, you're setup for long term productivity gains and stability. Since neither editor is going anywhere and they run on pretty much anything.

    But for many people, the initial learning curve just isn't worth it. Sublime, Atom and VS Code are all very popular because you just install them and start coding.

    I'd love to see someone shake up the space with a "modern" take on emacs and vim: native, fast, powerful, very configurable, terminal based, but also with a conscious view on the initial learning curve and out of the box usefulness.

  • losvedir 9 months ago

    > But for many people, the initial learning curve just isn't worth it. Sublime, Atom and VS Code are all very popular because you just install them and start coding.

    This does a great disservice to the quality and functionality of Sublime.

    I was a fluent vim user before switching to Sublime and have never looked back. The smooth (i.e. not line-by-line) scrolling and powerful multi-cursors were enough to draw me. The little things like a beautiful file explorer sidebar with icons-per-filetype, great package manager you can launch, search, and install from right in the editor, and yes, occasionally even the mini-map, all keep me here.

    There's a pervasive meme on HN that Sublime took off because of its lesser learning curve, and that if you're a professional programmer you should make the investment to learn vim and emacs. But this ignores that a lot of people who have already made that investment still find Sublime to be a better editor.

    While I can understand the importance of using an open source editor, that particular argument doesn't sway me since I'm happy enough using Sublime for now. If it stops getting updates or whatever, I can always switch back to vim, but for now I will use what I feel is the best editor for the job.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    Sublime took off cause it just works and it has a nice default color scheme and just enough batteries included to make it a functional programming environment for the 80% of programming situations. And it now has enough addons to increase quality of life in many areas and or solve the other 20% in many cases.

    If I install emacs it is just okay. It probably has syntax highlighting, depending on the Linux distribution. It probably doesn't have any quality of life improvements for language X. I can drop in a theme and colorize it pretty quickly to my liking. From there, emacs is still very powerful, but there are a lot of things I really love for long and deep editing sessions when I am going through a lot of files on a code review or what not.

  • nerdponx 9 months ago

    Don't forget: it can be arbitrarily extended in a popular programming language and it has an unrestricted free trial.

  • cdelsolar 9 months ago

    ST or Emacs?

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    ST. Python is the popular language. Elisp is... not popular. But you can do CL in emacs.

    As an aside I found the Leo editor not too long ago. http://leoeditor.com/ -- one of the few editors that made me think "that is a little new". Leo is implemented in Python.

    I wish there was a modern equivalent of emacs, only all Python. :)

  • nerdponx 9 months ago

    Yuck. I prefer what Neovim did: editor comminicates using RPCs with arbitrary external programs using over a socket. Zero language lock-in and maximum extensibility.

  • nerdponx 9 months ago

    Addendum: then again, you could use Python to do that.

  • jncraton 9 months ago

    > I'd love to see someone shake up the space with a "modern" take on emacs and vim: native, fast, powerful, very configurable, terminal based, but also with a conscious view on the initial learning curve and out of the box usefulness.

    This sounds like the micro text editor. I've committed a few features to it and use it daily:


    You might be interested in checking it out.

  • pinum 9 months ago

    I think you should forget the whole "terminal based" thing. TUI text editors don't make much sense anymore. Native GUIs are much less clunky and much more discoverable.

  • adamrt 9 months ago

    I have my development machine at Digital Ocean. My local machine is an under powered macbook air (underpowered now that I use lots of docker for development). I'll probably just get a tiny chromebook next as I just want a dumb terminal.

    I run emacs over ssh/tmux. I love it, emacs never shuts down, all my shells run through emacs as well. I can use any machine with my sshkey and be back to work immediately. I can increase the size of the machine, have public access to my dev box if needed. If I have a bad internet connection it doesnt matter since its just sending low bandwidth over ssh. All the real bandwidth comes from DigitalOcean and is super fast.

  • mov 9 months ago

    I do pretty much the same but using mosh instead of ssh. It's really stable even on low bandwidth of crappy mobile connection.

  • city41 9 months ago

    TUI still has advantages. Editing files over SSH is simpler, the app is easier to build cross platform, and for me personally the lack of a context switch when I'm in my terminal is nice. Even tiny little differences that keep you in your flow add up.

  • cholantesh 9 months ago

    I wish people would learn to appreciate that UX is subjective. I find most GUI-based editors to be RSI inducing. The level of effort required to change that is not worth it for me. Others may disagree. And that's fine.

  • udp 9 months ago

    Just because it's a GUI doesn't mean you have to use the mouse. I find gvim much faster than vim in the terminal because it doesn't have to print a screen full of glyphs for each update.

  • farresito 9 months ago

    On the other hand, vim + tmux is pretty awesome, and for that reason I prefer vim on the terminal. I've never particularly liked gvim, even if I'm not using tmux. In Linux, hitting the start or end of a buffer causes some sort of screen redraw that I've never been able to fix, but that might have to do with my configuration.

  • btschaegg 9 months ago

    Well let's not generalize on the clunky part; there's always Visual Studio ;-)

    I would generally agree with your point, especially on the discoverability front - this is why emacs and vim have an often dreaded learning curve. But OTOH, there are also a couple of rather nice benefits to the terminal focus that I don't currently see in more GUI focused editors. It would certainly be doable to replicate them, but it seems like no one's trying currently.

    So I would hold off on forgetting about the terminal until there's a viable alternative around.

    Oh, and: I've seen my fair share of botched remote access solutions on the Windows side of things and would probably use any TUI editor short of ed over any IDE in those situations. At least SSH is responsive.

  • 9 months ago
  • davidw 9 months ago

    I use Emacs in both modes.

  • flukus 9 months ago

    Check out kakoune, TUI based and very discoverable.

  • current_call 9 months ago

    But for many people, the initial learning curve just isn't worth it.

    I don't believe that. The people who snub Vim and Emacs, but are willing to sink time into learning new editors, new languages, and new frameworks have no excuse. If they were less susceptible to marketing, then they'd be able to learn something old every once in a while.

    I'd love to see someone shake up the space with a "modern" take on emacs and vim: native, fast, powerful, very configurable, terminal based, but also with a conscious view on the initial learning curve and out of the box usefulness.

    People have been attempting this for years with little success. The only projects I know of that have traction are Spacemacs and Neovim. The former is just an Emacs distribution and the latter is backwards compatible with Vim.

  • TylerE 9 months ago

    It is in fact possible to learn and KNOW Emacs and Vim and still prefer alternatives to either of them.

  • dsego 9 months ago


  • fra 9 months ago

    Kakoune doesn't run on Windows, so not cross-platform.

  • Pamar 9 months ago

    Current Status - from the readme:

    This is still a project in its early stages. The Mac build has basic editing functionality (it was used to write this README), but looks very spare and is still missing essentials such as auto-indent. At the moment, it’s expected that its main community will be developers interested in hacking on a text editor.

  • bobajeff 9 months ago

    Yeah, I'd love someone to make a text editor that is:

    * simple and non-tedious to use by default,

    * can run via terminal and ssh,

    * supports vim themes,

    * full support for Language Server Protocol,

    ---* (Can work with clangd)

    * fast and polished

  • pen2l 9 months ago

    Whereas Sublime "just works", emacs doesn't.

    But when you're on Windows, boy you have to do a LOT to get it to just work. I tried it (and spacemacs, as I'm quite familiar with vim) last month for doing some python work on Windows... I just gave up after 2 days.

  • smcl 9 months ago

    A couple of things that normally annoy me are that it's just a .zip file not an installer so the user has to figure out a "sensible" place to install it is ... and that there's like emacs.exe, emacsclient.exe, runemacs.exe or whatever - a bunch of .exes and it's not clear unless you've dug around a bit[0] which is "correct".

    But after that it was relatively plain-sailing for me. What else was troubling you? Note: it's possible that we've got totally different workloads and needs - not saying you're doing anything wrong, I'm just curious

    [0] - OK you don't have to dig far, (it's on https://www.gnu.org/software/emacs/download.html) but it still annoys me a tiny bit

  • lvoudour 9 months ago

    >That said, and I hate to be this guy (not really), but... Emacs?

    I intentionally didn't include console editors, totally different beasts. Never used emacs, only learned vim and only touched the surface, mostly use it when I ssh to remote machines. The pinnacle of flexibility and responsiveness but the learning curve... it's just too much for me.

    You're right though, it's a great investment and as the years pass and mouse usage takes its toll on my right hand fingers, keyboard only editors look even more appealing. Whenever though I sit down and try to code in vim I find my productivity plummeting. I know once I ride the curve things will improve but unfortunately I find it hard to persevere

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    I use emacs in an X window 90% of the time, but it almost universally translates over to a tty. Fonts are just easier when it runs as an X window :)

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    > keyboard only editors look even more appealing

    You don't say what editor or IDE you're currently using [ed: unless you mean ST? Which would be odd, because it doesn't need a mouse for anything], but few require mouse usage for much nowadays. You might be better off, at least in the first instance, just learning the keyboard shortcuts for the tool you're currently using.

  • computerex 9 months ago

    ST is not a modal text editor. I know there is a vim emulation plugin for ST that's reasonably good, but at face value someone who has mastered vim can edit text faster than vanilla ST because of vim's modal and compositional nature.

  • Boxxed 9 months ago

    Maybe grandparent poster just likes Sublime better. If he was an emacs user, would you have posted basically the same thing with "...and I hate to be this guy (not really), but... Sublime?"

  • komali2 9 months ago

    Gonna take advantage of having an emacs wizard around -

    I love vscode, but agreed, it's bog-slow sometimes, especially when I run in ubuntu. I'm looking around at emacs and I like what I'm seeing, but something that perhaps seems silly is still a bit of a turn off for me - it's pretty effing ugly. I don't mean in the theme sense, I mean in all the stuff cluttering the codepanes.

    In VScode I usually ctrl+k z for "zen mode," where the only thing you see is the tabs of your open files, and the code. ctrl+shift+e opens my file explorer when I need it, ctrl+b puts it away (or ctrl+p to go straight to a filename). Same for terminal, ctrl+`, do a git thing, ctrl+` buh bye. Anything similar for emacs? That level of quick control over the UI?

  • pech0rin 9 months ago

    You can easily do that in emacs.

    Throw this in your init.el

    (scroll-bar-mode -1)

    (tool-bar-mode -1)

    (menu-bar-mode -1)

    (global-linum-mode 0)

    And it will instantly look a lot cleaner. If you want to toggle it you can turn it into a function and bind it to a key.

  • pen2l 9 months ago

    > (scroll-bar-mode -1)

    ...what? You're gonna take away the scrollbar just like that? Implying that the scrollbar is worthless? Scrollbar is very important to me at least, (especially a well-implemented one). It gives me a quick and instant visual understanding of how big the file is, where I am currently in the file, etc. The only improvement I have seen on the scrollbar is Sublime's minimap... I knew there exist emacs methods to get it working, but I could not get it to work (on Windows) in less than a few days so that's of no use to me.

  • grzm 9 months ago

    The wonderful thing about the list provided by your parent is that it's optional. Pick and choose the pieces you want. Those may not be the same pieces your parent wants. Fortunately both of you can choose without inconveniencing the other.

  • uabstraction 9 months ago

    Worth noting also, with the default settings, Emacs tells you what your position is in the buffer in the mode line (Top, Bot, All, or a percent), so the scroll bar is redundant as a visual indicator.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    There is two default UI elements in my emacs config:

    Line numbers on the left and two lines at the bottom. One for the status bar and one for the "mini buffer" (where you put commands, search text, and receive short messages). Everything else is just the buffer (file) I am editing. You could turn the line numbers off with a simple configuration and key binding if you wanted, along with all the other UI elements.

    This goes to the "Zen" of my emacs config. Its always just the buffer I am editing unless I need another dialog or UI element. The trick to making this work with no tree based folder explorers are Projectile and Helm. Projectile adds "project" concept to emacs and Helm adds fuzzy searching of everything almost everywhere that matters. Both can be taught to work around git repos. So you can say, whack some keys and see a list of files in your project. Then start fuzzy matching in the helm buffer that results by typing say three letters of a file. If its unique you press enter. File is open. If I really need a tree or explore a directory there is `dired` mode which lets you walk around the file system. There are even tree modes that I find pointless after using helm and projectile.

    There is nothing built in by default. That is the biggest problem with emacs. You don't just sit down at it one day and get a polished environment that fits with what you like. It is something that is worked at. You eventually learn at least a little elisp and your customization powers keep growing. Eventually you either quit emacs or are good enough at lisp and configuring it that it becomes obvious, if not trivial, to do most things other editors can do.

    Generally speaking it is almost certain you can customize it if you are asking a question like, "Can I do X.". Everything in emacs, even configuration dialogs are just text buffers. You just teach emacs how to interpret different text buffers in different ways to implement special functionality. Most of the heavy lifting of integration with most languages is already done if your language is remotely popular.

    This was a long answer, but that goes to the heart of emacs. If you want a zen mode, emacs is there for you. You want a mode with weird little widgets and build output things everywhere, emacs has your back. :)

  • current_call 9 months ago

    You can make your Emacs setup minimalistic by hiding the toolbar and scrollbar. This blog post gives a pretty good starting setup. https://emacs-doctor.com/emacs-strip-tease.html

    C-x C-f opens files, but will also open a file explorer if the path is a directory. The 'q' key will immediately close the file explorer. I'm not sure about git interaction. I usually just use the Emacs shell to enter git commands.

  • jsilence 9 months ago

    Magit in emacs is highly recommended.

  • flatline 9 months ago

    Just get emacs prelude and configure it to use helm everywhere. It is so close to my previous custom emacs setup that I just install prelude now on a new system and run with it.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    I guess I never understood the custom emacs distributions for long time users. If you had a system that worked... lugging it around isn't hard. It is usually a few hundred lines of elisp plus packages, which you can freeze and zip up and they are probably going to work on an emacs release 5 or 6 years in the future.

    I don't worry about it cause I just backup my .emacs.d and restore it anywhere I plan on editing very long. My whole .emacs.d with tons of modes and add ons is 73MB.

    There /is/ something to be said with not making a mess of your initialization file and customizations. It is also very possible to keep glomming addons in and eventually get to a difficult place where various elements of extensions/modes/packages are fighting and that can be frustrating and I can see why many turn to well tuned emacs distributions.

  • innocentoldguy 9 months ago

    Emacs gives me RSIs due to the awkward chording. I love the idea of Emacs, but the reality is too painful. I love Vim though.

  • vacri 9 months ago

    > I copy my ~/.emacs.d to a server

    I think if you work on servers a lot, then it's a major advantage to use something like emacs or vim, because your editing environment is 'just there'. But heaps of developers rarely, if ever, find themselves in a terminal, so the portability advantage just isn't there for them.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    >That said, and I hate to be this guy (not really), but... Emacs?

    The shortcuts make it a non-starter for me.

    Having to configure stuff even more so.

  • danenania 9 months ago

    Exactly. Many people want their editor to be very flexible and configurable and micro-optimizable to suit their particular needs, and that's awesome if it's what floats your boat. On the other hand, there are many of us who want to think about our editor as little as possible.

    Sublime isn't perfect and it still requires tinkering from time to time, but its power vs. time investment equation is absolutely fantastic. It's a very get-shit-done style of editor. Emacs/vim are amazingly powerful but they are also big time sinks, both in terms of the initial learning curve and later customization.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    You are right. I view emacs as a sort of religion or philosophy of computing. I don't use the metaphor lightly. It is pretty apt. It is my religion, so I would never put it on anyone else. I will share the cool stuff about it, but not in an annoying way.

    The philosophy of using it is that eventually, in the long long term, the productivity gains should be reasonable or at least competitive with any other editor or environment. It should be a joy to use. Since I know I will probably only ever make a living crafting text I view it as an imperative to deeply master my primary tool. The other aspect is that it is free and old and stable. I can't ever achieve an RMS level of using open source things, but everywhere I can, I want the truly open thing, even if it isn't practical. I run Linux for this reason, even though it was a giant time sink making it behave and getting everything just so. But I can make things just so.

    This fits in also with creating a distraction free environment. i3wm, emacs, I barely even see application menus these days, but I still use a GUI, I am not crazy. But it fits with my philosophy/religion of computing, so I am going to do it this way. If others agree, great. If they want to know about it, I will share. If they think it's crazy, from their perspective they may be right!

  • computerex 9 months ago

    Learning curve can be a pain. Customization afterwards not necessarily, but I see where you're coming from. But once you are competent at Vim and you have it looking like you want it, it is nothing short of delightful. I feel motivated sometimes just because I get to work in Vim.


  • weaksauce 9 months ago

    spacemacs is solid if you want to try out a well configured emacs. magit, org mode, helm are amazing tools and part of the killer feature list of emacs. magit is so good even if I stopped using emacs tomorrow I would still use it for my git gui.


  • coldtea 9 months ago

    I try such distros every two years or so to see if it's gotten any better. Usually it's not worth my time from the start (fun thing is, I used to use Emacs for a year or so in uni, before turning to Vim and never looking back -- until I had to do Java, which meant Eclipse. I got back to Vim, but the last 5 years it's all ST with some sporadic attempts to like VSC).

    Let's do this in realtime. I downloaded the latest Spacemacs.

    1) Opening. Hmm, it's a zip not a DMG. Already losing me, but I'll stick, I'm not that shallow.

    2) Hmm, it's just a bunch of source files? I guess the prominent "Download" link just gives you the configuration, not a bundled editor. I have to get Emacs from somewhere else. Grr... Lemme check their "Quickstart".

    3) Yeah... the Quickstart link just gives you some BS that assumes you already know how to install this, and the "Install" button just gives a git command line to clone their repo. Back to square 1.

    4) Fuck it, I'll use brew to install Emacs. Spacemacs doesn't even say which version of Emacs it works best with. I'll risk with what brew gives me.

    5) Brew installation ends fine, with a caveat: "Please try the Cask for a better-supported Cocoa version". Now you tell me?

    6) Anyway, I have an emacs, lemme git clone spacemacs now. OK, comes up, nice logo. Now, I have a huge emacs window -- so why is it asking me "first time" config questions in a tiny space at the bottom? And why doesn't it explain better what the various options (distro flavors) entail?

    7) Let it do its install, then play around a bit. Close the window in evil mode (q!). I open emacs again, greeted with this:

      Found 1 new package(s) to install...
      --> refreshing package archive: gnu... [3/3]
      --> installing package: [email protected] [1/1]
      An error occurred while installing evil-unimpaired (error: (wrong-type-
      argument package-desc nil))
    Oh, and:

        - Cannot find any of the specified fonts (Source Code Pro)! Font settings 
        may not be correct.      
    8) I open some local source files to check. A buffer window appears on the right side with "warnings":

      Error (use-package): helm :config: Symbol’s value as 
      variable is void: helm-bookmark-map
    Yeah, fuck that. Back to ST3.
  • weaksauce 9 months ago

    To play devil's advocate here.

    you clicked on download instead of install. now, to be fair, download shouldn't be on the main screen imo but still install is more in line with what you were looking to do so it should have been the thing you clicked on. Cloning the repo is installing it if you have emacs installed already.

    It's open source so this can verbiage can be fixed. It's not a stand alone editor as it's a bunch of configurations to emacs.

    https://github.com/syl20bnr/spacemacs has better onboarding docs than the homepage does.

    At the end of the day it's a question of how much customization you want out of an editor. Reading the tone in your comment seems like you didn't want it to be successful at all anyway.

  • mjmein 9 months ago

    That's actually a pretty good barrier to entry. With emacs/spacemacs, if installing it is too frustrating for you, then configuring and using it is going to be way too frustrating for you.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    Yes. And god forbid it plays out of the box end to end with configuration/elisp being totally optional.

  • mjmein 9 months ago

    My opinion is that emacs/spacemacs is more optimized for day to day work, than for the out of box experience. Personally, I'm fine with that, and there are some great editors (like sublime) that work out of the box if you prefer that.

    However, the people generally working with/on emacs are not looking for that, they are looking for an editor optimized for customisation. They have already gone through the experience of setting it up, so why would they spend most of their time making it easier out of the box?

    There is a cost to everything, and so far most people on emacs side have decided to spend their time on improving it's power, not it's ease of use.

  • weaksauce 9 months ago

    For the most part it is completely optional to configure it and use elisp... it will ask you if you want to install a layer (group of packages) when you open up a filetype that it knows about and can handle. there is some configuration akin to setting up completion backend, linters, formatters etc that are applicable to your language/filetype of choice. The benefit of that is that the external tools are kept external where development of them can continue unimpeded by the development of the main text editor.

    similarly, once you get to know the language quirks, it's a decent language that is basically a DSL for text editing. The power you get from being able to lookup how something was implemented by the text editor developers easily is extremely powerful.

    If you like vim's idea of modal editing, emacs is 100% all about that. languages are major modes, minor modes are functions and keybindings that can be enabled and grouped together at will. transient buffers are used to send output to and are treated as normal buffers that you can do things to. The architecture and extensiblity of emacs is pretty amazing actually. Every key press is just a function and every key can be rebound based on current context using things like mode maps that get layered on top of everything and have precedence based on where you inserted the binding with sensible fallbacks when required.

    Disclaimer: I love vim as a concept but hate viml and the plugins that were hampered by the lame programming language that was designed by bram.

    if you have not tried magit and org mode you just don't really understand the power of emacs and the power of having everything be a function. spacemacs just makes setting up that powerful environment fairly painless but it's still a very old architecture with some warts.

  • knodi 9 months ago

    but...but...my poor pinky finger.

  • bitexploder 9 months ago

    Yes. I actually have a hard time using control now if it isn't capslock, heh. On other computers IT IS NOT UNCOMMON FOR ME TO END UP TYPING IN CAPS. That said, caps to control is a great quality of life improvement for anyone that uses CTRL for anything, but especially emacs users :)

  • menssen 9 months ago

    Recently, after some corporate IT crap required handing over my laptop for a weekend, it came back with a post-it note attached that said "your caps lock key is broken, let us know if you want a new computer."

  • groovy2shoes 9 months ago

    > That said, caps to control is a great quality of life improvement for anyone that uses CTRL for anything

    I agree. I've been a vim user for over a decade, but a few years ago I decided to try mapping capslock to ctrl and have never looked back. It's a much more natural place for a key that gets used as often as ctrl, while capslock is a key that is rarely used (as a matter of fact, my keymap doesn't even have a capslock at all anymore, and I haven't missed it!). Anyone who uses ctrl more often than capslock ought to give it a try, but beware:


    It's a real danger!

  • Pete_D 9 months ago

    I'd recommend this even for non-emacs users who use terminals a lot. The tiny bit of extra comfort from ctrl-C in a shell alone is worth it. Add in tmux ctrl-B, or any readline shortcuts you use a lot, and you're onto a winner.

  • knodi 9 months ago

    Ya, i did this a long time ago. All my computers have capsLock key mapped to CTRL

  • copperx 9 months ago

    Same here. That's the original layout of UNIX keyboards, after all.

  • knodi 9 months ago

    very cool, I didn't know that.

  • ythn 9 months ago

    I prefer VSCode if the hardware can handle it, but otherwise Sublime is my goto. If Sublime ever had as good Git support as VSCode I would permanently switch back to Sublime

  • badloginagain 9 months ago

    Honestly out of the box Git management for VSCode is really good. I'm surprised how quickly it got integrated to my regular workflow, and I'm a terminal gitter to boot.

  • ythn 9 months ago

    The ability to see side by side diffs and which files/lines I've touched is what did it for me. I still use git CLI for squashing, rebasing etc, but basic staging and committing I do entirely in VSCode now.

  • trishume 9 months ago

    I've been very satisfied with https://github.com/divmain/GitSavvy and GitGutter. Together they are how I do almost all of my git.

  • woodrowbarlow 9 months ago

    another vote for gitgutter. jumping to the next changed hunk in my currently open file is a life-changer.


  • y0ssar1an 9 months ago

    If you want git support out of the box, please give me a thumbs up on this PR. https://github.com/sublimehq/Packages/pull/1126 If you can read sublime-syntax files, code review is appreciated as well.

    With this package, you can set Sublime to be your git editor like this:

      $ cat ~/.gitconfig
        editor = subl -w
  • erichdongubler 9 months ago

    GitGutter and GitSavvy have been fantastic for my Git mileage -- have you tried them?

  • hasenj 9 months ago

    I prefer VSCode mostly for the intellisense/auto-complete.

    As far as git is concerned, I use it from the command line an cannot understand why anyone would want to interact with git from VSCode or any other text editor.

  • skocznymroczny 9 months ago

    I don't know if these editors support it, but being able to access git blame from editor is convenient, also the editor can highlight all the changes you've done since the last revision (especially useful to hunt down unnecessary whitespace changes).

  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    I think Will Bond has a git plugin that's supposed to be pretty good. I don't like VCS plugins in my editor though, so I've never tried it.

  • meritt 9 months ago

    Text editors shouldn't come with hardware requirements.

  • rattray 9 months ago

    All software has hardware requirements.

  • yflu 9 months ago

    Even ed has hardware requirements.

  • koenpunt 9 months ago

    Have you ever tried TextMate? Since like me, you don't like "IDE-like features" I can imagine TextMate 2 could be a better fit than Sublime, especially in respect to file management. And a lot of Sublime bundles are compatible with TextMate (and the other way around of course, since these bundles originate from TM)

  • kylebebak 9 months ago

    Sublime Text is among the best pieces of software I've used. I bought the license a couple of years ago, and would gladly pay the same amount again.

    I love its core functionality: speed and stability, search, command palette, file navigation, Goto. I've used a number of editors over the years, and none have felt as fundamentally sound as Sublime Text.

    The best feature of all is the Python plugin API. Sublime lacks some OOTB functionality of newer editors, but the plugin ecosystem makes this a non-issue if you're willing to invest in extending your editor. If you write code 6+ hours a day, you should be. Git integration (GitGutter and GitSavvy) is awesome, as is linting (SublimeLinter) and project management (ProjectManager).

    I wrote an HTTP client plugin for Sublime called Requester (https://github.com/kylebebak/Requester) in a few thousand lines of code. It matches Postman, Insomnia, Paw et al. on features, and in my opinion handily beats them on usability. It's the plugin API that makes this possible.

    Here's my guess on what Jon Skinner set out to do with Sublime Text: build a rock-solid text editor and make it as extensible as possible. Until someone does this better, Sublime is the best editor out there.

  • ehsankia 9 months ago

    Sublime just makes editing fun for me. Especially with the ctrl+d multi-selection.

    When it comes to editors, there's definitely a big spectrum of how much it does vs how lightweight/simple it is, and I think Sublime Text, for a majority of my usecases at least, is in the sweet spot.

    Don't get me wrong, full fledged IDEs are useful sometimes too, but every time I go to use them, I always spend half my time searching and fighting the program instead of being productive. That's what I mean by Sublime making programming fun. Things don't get in your way and everything is very clean. Sure it may do less, but at least it doesn't drown you in features you don't use either.

  • kylebebak 9 months ago

    I love Sublime for writing anything, not just code.

    MarkdownEditing (https://github.com/SublimeText-Markdown/MarkdownEditing), optionally combined with Distraction Free mode, is my preferred setup for anything that's not code: docs, blog posts, prose, etc.

  • dualogy 9 months ago

    The plugin API seems powerful enough but last time I tried to play with it, I didn't get into the groove of things because docs were incomplete/not-up-to-speed/blog-posts-elsewhere-also-often-outdated, all this combined with Python-the-language it felt a bit too fickle/messy to me to get serious --- there was no comparison to the quite brilliant docs at https://code.visualstudio.com/docs/extensionAPI/overview when I weighed my options ---

    But now that 3 is out of beta, I'll take another look and once again hope for an exhaustive, complete, up-to-date and comprehensive documentation of plugin development

  • kylebebak 9 months ago

    I've found the docs to be complete but lacking in examples.

    Examples often say more in 10 lines of code than a page of docs, but I didn't find this to be an issue. To write Requester, I cloned plugins with features I wanted to implement (e.g. GitSavvy) and used them to complement the docs.

    I think the docs could be improved with examples of small useful plugins that touch on various areas of the API. This might be a good project for the community.

  • kylebebak 9 months ago

    Just to clarify: the docs are rustic but complete. The API itself is immensely powerful.

  • RossDM 9 months ago

    Just checked out Requester today - what a fantastic plugin! We use Postman a lot but I can easily see this gaining traction in our office. Great job.

  • slowmovintarget 9 months ago

    > I bought the license a couple of years ago, and would gladly pay the same amount again.

    Same here... In fact, I just did plunk down my money again.

  • pretzel 9 months ago

    > and would gladly pay the same amount again.

    Looks like I'm going to have to. Only free upgrades to people to bought after 2013...

  • sleepyhead 9 months ago

    Which is very generous. It's FOUR years ago!

  • nmblackburn 9 months ago

    That is when the BETA builds started, you effectively pre-ordered it if you bought a license at that point in time.

  • sleepyhead 9 months ago

    No, I bought a license for ST2. Also, the beta was opt-in.

  • Sir_Cmpwn 9 months ago

    >apt/yum/pacman repositories for Linux

    Major kudos to these guys for distributing their software properly on Linux!

  • teamhappy 9 months ago

    Let me rephrase that.

    Major kudos to these guys for enduring distributing their software properly on Linux!

  • favadi 9 months ago

    In the past few months, I see some popular linux softwares started to using AppImage (https://appimage.org/) to distribute prebuilt binary. Not sure if it is a good option for SublimeText.

  • Sir_Cmpwn 9 months ago

    I'm not a big fan of AppImage. It takes everything good about static linking and then fucks it all up.

  • catwell 9 months ago

    That's what electro-build does by default. It's a terrible solution for end users, because it results in huge bloated statically-linked images, but at least it works everywhere.

    I do prefer what Sublime Text is doing here though. Kudos to them, it's a lot of work.

  • gkya 9 months ago

    It's easy to write a PKGBUILD for Arch, and IDK RPM but writing a Debian package is not that hard too, I've written a .deb that installs all the software I use on Ubuntu Gnome and it's just a directory and two or three files. Its docs could use a bit of help though, the Debian handbook is sometimes very superficial.

  • gcp 9 months ago

    Well, offering a repo is yet another step further than just putting a .deb on the website.

  • mattl 9 months ago

    Would you share how you made that deb? Sounds useful.

  • gkya 9 months ago

    I just made a blog post on this: http://www.gkayaalp.com/deb.html

  • mattl 9 months ago


  • hexmiles 9 months ago

    i think the hard part is maintaining it more than creating it. Library dependency and testing.

    There is a lot more than just creating a package.

  • AsyncAwait 9 months ago

    I vastly prefer it to hunting for executables on websites, thank you. And there isn't that many relevant distress to target, especially with things like Flatpack etc.

  • diminish 9 months ago

    I second this. It's one of the rare non-default apps I'm installing on by Linux workstations!

  • AsyncAwait 9 months ago

    I agree, too many just ship a deb or a simple archive, which is not the best update experience for non-Ubuntu users, even if i.e. the AUR solves most of the pain.

  • 9 months ago
  • mlcdf 9 months ago

    It reminds me that Atom still does have an official repository...

  • mlcdf 9 months ago

    doesn't* --'

  • andrepd 9 months ago

    You can edit your post instead of replying with a correction.

  • AceJohnny2 9 months ago

    Only within a 1h (or so?) window.

  • jcolella 9 months ago

    "One of the areas I'm especially proud of in Sublime Text 3 is performance". I totally agree with this statement. Writing software in sublime has certainly made my life easier. Kudos to Jon and team.

  • noway421 9 months ago

    I opened 70mb file on a macbook air the other day, and apart from around 7 sec loading time, i didn't notice that it is any more than a 100 kb just by the UI feel. Really great job.

  • mistercow 9 months ago

    Every so often, I like to take a moment to appreciate how quickly fully highlighted files flit past while typing in the fuzzy file search prompt.

  • bad_user 9 months ago

    I like Sublime Text, but one thing that has really annoyed me is the lack of support for font ligatures.

    See https://github.com/tonsky/FiraCode

    It's a superficial reason, but I've gotten very used to them in Emacs, IntelliJ IDEA, VS Code and Atom, yes, I'm still using all of them interchangeably :-(

  • eberkund 9 months ago

    Supporting this is apparently requires major changes to their rendering engine so probably won't be added until at least version 3.1 or 4.

  • SirensOfTitan 9 months ago

    I find it as superficial as enjoying your editor font. It definitely matters to many of us I think. Sublime has a lot to be desired on the font rendering front from my perspective. I will definitely revisit Sublime once they tackle that presumably in 3.1 or 4.

  • joncalhoun 9 months ago

    Kudos to the ST team for never trying to patent or sue random companies for using the multi-select feature. That feature alone has helped improve so many editors.

  • danielvf 9 months ago

    Note that that feature was in TextMate, which was Sublime's inspiration.

  • jskinner 9 months ago

    No, it wasn't. I believe TextMate had a feature where you could edit multiple lines at once, but it was part of a column selection mode, it certainly wasn't free form multiple selections.

    Multiple Selections were one of the earliest core features built for Sublime Text, and weren't inspired from other software. I don't think TextMate existed when I implemented this.

  • mmjaa 9 months ago

    PC-Write had it, long, long ago and .. like ST .. this feature was the only reason I used that app.

  • shubhamjain 9 months ago

    I can't comment on how well it was implemented in PC-Write but it won't be far-fetched to say that Sublime made multiple-selections mainstream. I had seen some references to vim plugins that offered that feature but it had limited abilities. The three ways of doing multiple selections—selecting multiple instances of a word, placing multiple cursors downwards in succeeding lines, and using point and click—made Sublime's implementation vastly more powerful.

  • mmjaa 9 months ago

    Back in the day (early-mid 80's), PC-Write was kind of like the SublimeText of the era.

    Multiple-select was indeed one of the key reasons to use it, as a programmers editor, even though it was intended for more general-purpose word processing tasks.

    Anecdotal experience: my first unboxing of ST2 led to the proclamation: "finally, someone has done multi-select cursors again, almost as good as PC-Write back in the day!"

  • armandososa 9 months ago

    hey! I used PC-write back in the nineties. I have nothing to add, just happy to find another user of that softeare.

  • danielvf 9 months ago

    You are correct - as you already know. I was wrong

    TextMate 1 had multiple column editing, but true multi caret editing was not until TextMate 2 in 2011.

  • jacobolus 9 months ago

    It had already been implemented in the alpha versions of TextMate 2 earlier. But it’s quite plausible that the two implementations were independent.

    ... Unlike most of Sublime Text which was a close copy of TM features except for the ability for users to edit customizations, making the Sublime community a giant leech that sucked all of the air out of TextMate bundle development without ever contributing anything back.

    Sad history.

  • joncalhoun 9 months ago

    EDIT: Leaving the original comment below for posterity, but it looks like the TextMate article I found on this doesn't predate ST's multi-select, so I have no idea which is true. I'll just take the ST devs at their word :)

    Interesting. TIL

    It even looks like TextMate implemented the individual copy/paste buffer for each cursor correctly as well, something that VSCode had horribly wrong the last time I tried to use it.

    Do you know if this only worked with the cmd+click cursors, or did it also support the cmd+d mode to select the same word in multiple places?

    Regardless, kudos to TextMate as well :)

  • jhgb 9 months ago

    Didn't Emacs have something like this before ST?

  • hellofunk 9 months ago

    Probably. I've used it in Emacs for quite a while, but I'm not sure where that falls in the history with the sublime text.

  • giancarlostoro 9 months ago

    Indeed, they at the very least made it known / very popular to use. I realized JetBrains IDE's have support for it as well and it comes in really handy from time to time.

  • tskaiser 9 months ago

    multi-select is by no means an ST invention.

  • jskinner 9 months ago

    As far as I'm aware it is. If you know of an implementation done before 2008 I'd love to know about it.

  • mmjaa 9 months ago

    PC-Write had it in the 80's.


  • icebraining 9 months ago

    In LAPIS (1999), you could not only select multiple things, as it could guess what you meant to select based on the structure of the text: http://groups.csail.mit.edu/graphics/lapis/index.html

  • 9 months ago
  • panic 9 months ago

    jEdit appears to have had multiple cursors since at least 2005, though I don't know how useful they were.

  • billbrown 9 months ago

    Out of curiosity: I looked up the jEdit developer and it turns out that he's currently working on the Swift compiler at Apple!


  • billbrown 9 months ago

    They worked great and I stayed with jEdit long past when it was reasonable to do so because of that and so many other amazing features.

  • icebraining 9 months ago

    Why did it stop being reasonable?

  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    jEdit was a seriously under rated text editor, I used the CRAP out of it in college.

  • badsectoracula 9 months ago

    Was? It is still being developed, the last version was released six months ago:


  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    nice, I had no idea.

  • throwaway6845 9 months ago

    OS X has always had it, albeit a fairly limited implementation. Try it in TextEdit.

  • clairity 9 months ago

    yes! this was the feature that won me over (on top of the great syntax highlighting on black background). /happy sublime text user

  • mstade 9 months ago

    I honestly can't believe I'm saying this, but: can you please enable me to buy a new license for 4.0 even though it may not even be on the road map yet? Or switch to / enable a subscriber model which is paid yearly and gives access to all upgrades?

    I rely so much on sublime for my day to day work and I fear the $80 or whatever I paid for it whenever ago is too cheap for the amount of value I'm getting out of it, and I'd hate to see this magnificent piece of software fall by the wayside because of an unsustainable business model.

    Of course, if the business is perfectly sustainable then you know, carry on as you where.

  • 5_minutes 9 months ago

    I understand your appreciation for the software but begging for another subscription fee? One feature here is that the authors charge a normal fee and are not greedy in your pockets, like 1Password and many others.

    I really do appreciate the classic software pricing.

    It could be a higher fee, or more frequent but I'm really tired of all the Recurring costs!

  • cletus 9 months ago

    Thing is, software unlike say a book or a movie has sometimes significant maintenance costs. There are always bugs to be fixed, security vulnerabilities are found, third-party libraries need to be upgraded and so on.

    The danger of the one-off model is that it sometimes creates the wrong incentives. Features and even bug fixes get pushed into newer versions, which may even delay their release until there's enough of them to justify a new version.

    A good example of this going awry is the RAW file processing for Photoshop (pre-subscription). Newer cameras would get added to new versions of the Camera Raw plugin but you needed a new version of Photoshop to use the newer Camera Raw versions.

    I honestly don't mind the subscription model and I think Jetbrains has about the best one of all: you get constant acess to upgrades. When you choose to stop subscribing, that simply locks in the latest version you can use (ie you don't lose access entirely).

    The problem is many companies price subscriptions wrong. They say "our software costs $600 so we should charge $50/month". Because, you know, recouping that cost in a year is somehow reasonable.

  • tjoff 9 months ago

    Well, in contrast to a physical thing selling two copies is exactly as costly as selling one. I'd argue that that more than covers the cost of continued development.

    I can't say I recognize that wrong incentives in real life and I've yet to find a single piece of software that I'm willing to pay a subscription for.

    It all comes down to business ethics, are you trying to rip off your customers? Most can't afford to piss off their paying users so they play nice (and I hope that is not the only reason they are being reasonable).

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    "Well, in contrast to a physical thing selling two copies is exactly as costly as selling one."

    Statements like this ignore the costs of creating it in the first place.

  • bendev_test 9 months ago

    No, they don't. Even if the costs of creation were extremely high, selling more copies wouldn't change these costs.

  • xapata 9 months ago

    I happily subscribe to bunches of services. Some I don't even use, I'm just keeping the option open. Am I being ripped off? I don't think so.

  • tomc1985 9 months ago

    Not everyone feels that way. Some services are worth it of course, but there are a lot of pretenders that have entered the picture who do not sell things worthy of a subscription. There is an older model of software as eternal, you finish the program and then move on to the next bigger and better program. At least then your old userbase doesn't get as shafted.

  • xapata 9 months ago

    > not worthy [of your money]

    It's easier to cancel a subscription than get a refund on a license.

  • tomc1985 9 months ago

    But those are entirely different measures. Not worthy of a subscription does not mean not worthy of my money, it simply means it is not worthy of my money on a recurring basis. Perhaps I am one of those seemingly rare consumers that did not mind high one-off costs, even in my poorer years -- in the end you still own the thing, or at least it's bits. Subscriptions net nothing over the long term and their recurring spikes will eat people to death.

  • tjoff 9 months ago

    Well, I didn't mean to say that people buying subscriptions are being ripped off.

    But rather that companies that don't offer subscriptions can't game on features and bug-fixes just to fish for upgrade fees before people feel (rightly so) ripped off. There is an implicit agreement on the support provided and if the company fails to deliver that people won't play along.

  • xapata 9 months ago

    Isn't that the other way around? If I buy a license and I find a bug a year later, there's no guarantee of a fix. If I am subscribing, I can threaten to cancel.

  • tjoff 9 months ago

    It was a direct response to the parent.

    Also, if you loose access when you stop subscribing that is actually much harder to do compared to not paying for an upgrade if you "own" a license of the software.

  • xapata 9 months ago

    Good point. I guess your stance will depend on how troublesome the bug or feature request is.

  • mattacular 9 months ago

    You're merely ripping yourself off sounds like :)

  • webbrahmin 9 months ago

    I completely agree with you. I was a user of Balsamiq mock-up tool. But since they moved on to subscription model I stopped using it.

  • arkitaip 9 months ago

    Balsamic mockups desktop is still a single 99 USD purchase. Maybe you thinking of the other versions?

  • jwr 9 months ago


    Software is something that needs to be continuously developed and maintained. Charging a one-time fee is a fundamentally unsustainable approach. We all have to face reality and start paying for software as a subscription.

    Now, that will likely end the bubble of "I can buy 100 apps, most of which I'll never use", which we have been in for the last 20 years or so. But perhaps the few apps that people will pay for will become better as a result. I'm hoping for it.

  • sangnoir 9 months ago

    > Software is something that needs to be continuously developed and maintained.

    Not always. Sometimes software is "done" and warrants no further changes or maintenance. I have run into this issue with mobile apps that worked perfectly to my satisfaction until the authors decided to "redesign" or "improve" it. I think subscription is a valid use case for customers who want active maintenance, but it should be opt-in. I detest the forced-subscription model that JetBrains attempted ("Didn't pay the latest subscription? We'll brick the application you've installed and are running on your hardware").

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    " I detest the forced-subscription model that JetBrains attempted ("Didn't pay the latest subscription? We'll brick the application you've installed and are running on your hardware")."

    They never attempted that. You were always able to use the version you paid for, even if you stopped your subscription.

  • sangnoir 9 months ago

    > They never attempted that

    Oh, but they did[1]. You might have missed the initial drama as it transpired because of their quick U-turn (to their credit). I have reason to doubt the subscription plans they published which clearly stated that failure to keep up with the subscription would lead to bricked IDEs. JetBrains only backtracked[2] after receiving sustained pushback. There were HN posts for the initial bricking plan[3] and the backtrack[4].

    1. http://bytecrafter.blogspot.com/2015/09/how-jetbrains-lost-y...

    2. https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2015/09/18/final-update-on-t...

    3. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10170089

    4. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=10278285

  • FooBarWidget 9 months ago

    Sometimes, sure. But nowadays software is more often than not something that isn't simply done and needs continuous updates, in the face of security vulnerabilities, changing requirements (people using the software for changing use cases), platform updates (new version of macOS or Linux that breaks compatibility), etc.

  • cdelsolar 9 months ago

    Do they actually brick it? I thought they just stopped upgrading it.

  • sangnoir 9 months ago

    Reposting links I added in another reply. Yes they announced the bricking plans (http://bytecrafter.blogspot.com/2015/09/how-jetbrains-lost-y...) and then backtracked (https://blog.jetbrains.com/blog/2015/09/18/final-update-on-t...) - which is why I said "attempted".

  • scaryclam 9 months ago

    Quite honestly, I don't mind paying a subscription for updates. But I detest having to pay a subscription when all I want is a single copy and don't require rolling updates and support.

    Charging a one time fee works just fine for lots of folks out there making software. It's especially good for anyone who's doing it in their spare time as they don't have to provide updates for every little niggle someone may find. Some offer a subscription alongside the one-off model, which is the best of both worlds if the developer(s) are continuously working on it. Others ask you to purchase the major upgrades but give minor upgrades for free.

    There are lots of payment models out there, and the developers should pick what works for both them and their customers. There's no way most of my colleagues who have a license would have purchased sublime if it was a rolling cost, so that model seems to be working in their favor right now, at least for single developer purchases.

  • qrbLPHiKpiux 9 months ago

    The public does not give two shats what it costs you. In thier eyes they want it faster cheaper better.

  • aantix 9 months ago

    For a piece of software that enables your career, helps you to provide for yourself and/or family, that you probably utilize for thousands of hours over a given year?

    ST3 is continuously improved. They are developers. They eat. They have families. Just like you receive a salary, because the software you work on, probably is never done. Why would anyone feel entitled to improvements for a flat rate? Is that not greedy?

  • ricardobeat 9 months ago

    Gratuitous appeal to emotion. Sublime is already paid software, they are already eating, the commenter wasn't asking for it for free. It is not on the cheap end either - I have paid less for way more powerful and man-hours-consuming image/vector editors. Everything is fine.

  • chipotle_coyote 9 months ago

    Well. As a long-time Sublime Text user who sort of drifted off to Atom and VS Code in recent times, here's the thing: ST really hasn't been continuously improved; the sole developer frequently goes incommunicado for months, and there have been long stretches when there weren't any builds released. There are certainly substantial improvements between ST2 and ST3, but it's been over five years between ST2's initial release and ST3's. This is--kind of a worrisome pace of development.

    So, this leaves me of two minds about a hypothetical subscription model. If it meant that ST's developers had an ongoing income that allowed them to work full-time on the project, set a regular release schedule, and be more open with communication, it would be worth it. But if users had been asked to pay, say, $49 a year for the last five years with ST3 on an "um, they pop up once a year to say they're still working on it, I guess" schedule, I'm pretty confident it would have gone over even more poorly than what actually happened.

  • user5994461 9 months ago

    Yes. There are endless text editors doing the same for free.

  • alansammarone 9 months ago

    I could never find one that is as well thought and as well written as Sublime, and I've tried many, many others before.

  • andyhmltn 9 months ago

    Switched from Sublime to VSCode a few months ago and I've found it better to my needs. It's free

  • chewyland 9 months ago

    I love Code. It's one of Microsoft's greatest masterpieces.

  • simplify 9 months ago

    Not quite free – you're paying in ram. EDIT: I mean more ram than you would use in Sublime.

    You already paid by buying a faster computer. Some don't want to upgrade their computer; in this case, sublime is well worth its price.

  • lottin 9 months ago

    Well-written? I thought it was closed-source.

  • dexterdog 9 months ago

    I assume he was talking about the lack of significant bugs.

  • eridal 9 months ago

    > [...] that you probably utilize for thousands of hours over a given year

    Assuming 4hs net per day, 20 days/month, 12 months .. thats 960 hours/year

    And that's assuming that you spent all those 4 hours _entirely_ on your text editor; no cli, no browser, no nothing.. only text editor.

    I'd say that on avg we should be doing ~200 hours per year.. Are there any study about this?

  • joshuamorton 9 months ago

    The average number of hours worked by a fulltime employee is approximately 2000.

    Obviously not everyone will be using their editor more than half the time, but many do. And many often use their editor outside of work too.

  • heartbreak 9 months ago

    Are you suggesting that everyone with an 8-5 job works in Sublime Text for at most 4 hours of the day?

  • 9 months ago
  • hungerstrike 9 months ago

    I have a family and I have to eat, so give me your money and I'll give you a copy of VSCode that I worked on. I'll also give you the source code with that.

    It's a way better deal (and arguably a better tool) than what you get with Sublime.

  • Volt 9 months ago

    >For a piece of software that enables your career, helps you to provide for yourself and/or family, that you probably utilize for thousands of hours over a given year?

    Speak for yourself.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    He obviously speaks for people who use ST as their editor. The grandparent expressed his opinion as one, and the parent answered as another.

    People who don't have no says whatsoever in this particular subthread discussion.

  • Volt 9 months ago

    The first line is the part I'm quoting, which is obviously what I'm addressing. He's making assumptions about the commenter that are completely unwarranted.

    So no, he doesn't speak for the people who use ST.

  • aantix 9 months ago

    It's Hacker News. We're discussing a mainstream code editor. There are multiple discussions of code/libraries/engineering every day.

    The generalization that implies that the OP is a person who codes for a living is far from "completely unwarranted".

  • Volt 9 months ago

    There are plenty of students and hobbyists here. So again, take it easy on the assumptions.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    If the description of the parent doesn't fit you then maybe you weren't his/hers intended audience?

    No reason to tell everyone about it.

    If someone comments: "It's not much to pay $70 for something you use professionally, and get value out of it everyday etc" -- it only adds noise to chime in "I don't use it professionally" or "I don't use it everyday".

    It's a conditional sentence (even if implicit). If one is not on that category, then yes, obviously the argument doesn't apply to them.

  • eberkund 9 months ago

    Exactly, for every one person like this there are probably many who would not renew if they went subscription. It's not like they rely entirely on new customers, the company only has two employees and I'm sure ST3 will be out for a few years and then ST4 will come along. Software companies existed long before "cloud licensing" became the norm.

  • 8draco8 9 months ago

    I am not fan of replacing classic pricing model with recurring payments but instead of forcing recurring payment, allow that option for extra feature. Make the base app as it is now and add something on top of that for small fee. Like I suggested earlier, make small cloud service for syncing configs, addons and projects between installations. It's not a big thing, not deal breaking, it can be even done using rsync by user but I would happily pay couple dollars for that functionality and I would support devs. Development is recurring cost. Without aggressive marketing, like for example Microsoft, it's very hard to pay developers from selling not recurring licences every 3 or 4 years.

  • eberkund 9 months ago

    I would be okay with them having an optional cloud service for syncing settings.

    But the issue you talk about is where major version upgrades come in. Sublime text could cease all development tomorrow and not pay another cent towards development, should people have to continue to pay to keep using it? If new major feature are requested then that is grounds for charging and upgrade fee, otherwise I don't see why people should pay.

  • 9 months ago
  • matthew349hall 9 months ago

    WOOOHOOOOO! License system for the win! I am getting tired of everyone from Autodesk to Apple switching to subscription methods. Subscriptions enable the company to never push new features, buying the software outright introduces motive to add features.

  • briandear 9 months ago

    Greedy? 1Password requires servers. You’re “consuming” that every month. Perhaps if 1Password cost $200 one time?

  • izacus 9 months ago

    1Password works (or worked) without use of their servers by storing datastore on 3rd party cloud, which incurred no costs to them.

  • 5_minutes 9 months ago

    5/month to store 1kb of passwords

  • xapata 9 months ago

    No. $5/mo to manage my team's sharing of accounts.

  • mmargerum 9 months ago

    I’m having a big problem paying monthly for a password manager . May have to just roll my own in swift

  • dabockster 9 months ago

    There's always KeePassX if they're still around.

  • rodorgas 9 months ago

    There is no open source mobile alternative active or big enough to be properly audited/trusted.

  • mkarnicki 9 months ago

    KeeWeb.info - there you go. Open Source, $0.

  • rodorgas 9 months ago

    I was using MiniKeePass but it was hard to keep sync.

    I'm worried about using the hosted version of KeeWeb, also it doesn't seems as practical as a standalone app. But I'll definitely try to host myself (or use locally on the phone?) and give a try. Thanks.

  • mehs 9 months ago

    Take a look at Enpass (https://www.enpass.io) it has a free desktop app and one off fee for mobile apps. I've been using it for tree or four months and it's been great.

  • provemewrong 9 months ago

    Noone's stopping you from buying more licences, if you really want to support the dev. I think it's overpriced as it is (as another commenter mentioned, considering the competition is FOSS), but I might buy it one day, when I have more disposable money (assuming I won't have switched to VSCode or $hotNewThing by then). I really do like Sublime, and I'm happy 3 is out of beta, but seeing the userbase migrate to Atom/VSCode is worrisome, and makes me doubt $80 is worthwhile investment (I'm mostly worried about third party plugin devs, which was once Sublime's biggest strength).

  • aaron_oxenrider 9 months ago

    I use Sublime and paid for it a few years ago. That said, I also use VS Code which I really like for certain things. I actually use both of them daily and simply get different utility from them. If Sublime went to subscription then I would make do with other products. VS Code has a robust plugin ecosystem and I see that growing in the near future. I honestly think Sublime will eventually end up as FOSS. Whether that is from a drop or increase in subscribers I don't know.

  • bakli 9 months ago

    It needs to provide you with just enough productivity to help you work for 2 extra hours, and it'll have paid for itself. $80 is peanuts for this.

  • provemewrong 9 months ago

    I don't live in the United States so my purchasing power from two hours of work is exponentially smaller, but I get your point. Truth is, I don't really use Sublime (or any other text editor) that often anymore, because I'm working with Java and using IntelliJ IDEA for that. If I used Sublime Text professionally, I (or my employer) would have bought the licence in a heartbeat.

  • ship_it 9 months ago

    Does every developer earns $80 for two hours? No.

  • TheKarateKid 9 months ago

    Can someone please explain to me why $80 for Sublime Text is a good price for a text editor?

    I'm not flaming, I genuinely want to know. I've tried Gedit, Atom, VS Code, Notepad++ and I fail to see what Sublime offers over those to justify the price.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    >I'm not flaming, I genuinely want to know. I've tried Gedit, Atom, VS Code, Notepad++ and I fail to see what Sublime offers over those to justify the price.

    It's better than Gedit in every way, it's way faster and more lightweight than Atom and VS Code, and it has a far better plugin ecosystem and functionality than Notepad++.

    I'd pay triple the price.

  • amelius 9 months ago

    > it's way faster and more lightweight

    Now you've got me wondering why editor speed is actually a thing.

  • eggpy 9 months ago

    Not only does the editor need to track project folders and open files, even something seemingly simple like syntax highlighting can be surprisingly complex[0]. The editor needs to be able to read your inputs (mouse and keyboard) and represent those changes onscreen just like every other piece of software. It needs to repaint the screen with your changes and, depending on the complexity of the editor, load and implement a host of features (auto-complete? bracket matching? code indentation? code standards a la pep8? updates to source control?), with every single keypress and ideally in a matter of milliseconds. All of that takes memory and different editors make different sacrifices.

    Of course the extent to which this happens is the whole reason there are different editors. If all you want to do is write text with zero features, then speed isn't an issue at all and you can just write directly in your terminal to a single file with pico or something.

    [0] https://code.visualstudio.com/blogs/2017/02/08/syntax-highli...

  • vacri 9 months ago

    > even something seemingly simple like syntax highlighting can be surprisingly complex

    I was troubleshooting something with a colleague who was using Atom, and every time he opened a new file, it'd take somewhere between 1 and 2 seconds before the syntax highlighting was applied. As someone who's in and out of files all day, that'd drive me bananas.

  • buttscicles 9 months ago

    Slow software is frustrating. A text editor is a tool, it should help and not hinder.

  • Pxl_Buzzard 9 months ago

    There are a lot of factors that play into the speed (perceived and real) of an editor. Sublime is written in C, which is generally recognized as a performant language when used correctly. In contrast, Atom and VS Code are Electron[1] apps, which mean they have to deal with browser optimization. They both use a lot of tricks[2] to operate as quickly as they do. And in all editors, one bad extension can kill performance, from my recent experience Resharper in Visual Studio increases startup time by 3x.

    An editor is not as simple as displaying lines of text a la Notepad, different editors optimize for different use cases.

    1. https://electron.atom.io/

    2. http://blog.atom.io/2017/06/22/a-new-approach-to-text-render...

  • saagarjha 9 months ago

    Sublime Text is written is C++ FYI.

  • coldtea 9 months ago

    The same reason its annoying when any other kind of program is slow, especially interactive ones.

    I don't want to see freezes for 2-3 seconds for some GC run, I don't want the letters to appear several 100ms after I've typed, I don't want to wait minutes for it to parse a large-ish file or update the autocomplete suggestions.


  • xapata 9 months ago

    You mean why some editors are slow or why I care?

    Not sure about the first.

    I care about speed because I like to use "large" files. I prefer a few large files to many small files.

  • melq 9 months ago

    Try using something like xcode or a jetbrains IDE with a large codebase (for the record I like jetbrains software, but it can be slow comparatively).

    edit: not sure I correctly understood the parent

  • hughes 9 months ago

    Having tried Atom, it's the main reason I stuck with Sublime. Somehow, even typing was slow in some larger files...

  • colecut 9 months ago

    It matters for huge files

  • Touche 9 months ago

    So not source code, for the most part.

  • mehs 9 months ago

    I don't use Sublime Text as an IDE (I have Intellij for that), mainly to edit scripts, large CSV files, as a scratchpad etc. but It's always open and increases my productivity a lot.

  • nichochar 9 months ago

    It's highly likely that OP simply stumbled upon it, or someone recommended it, and now he learned it and is used to it and knows how productive it can be.

    Thing is, same is true for any other good IDE, of which there are plenty.

    Personally, it always blows my mind that people don't use VIM :) if they actually spent 5-20hours learning VIM correctly they would not touch these inferior pretty looking UIs

  • dheera 9 months ago

    Agree! I do almost everything in VIM for file-efficient languages and environments (NodeJS projects, Python projects, HTML, C++ ROS packages, most things that promote DRY coding, etc.)

    For file-inefficient environments (e.g. Java/Android -- 79 files for a "hello world" Android app!) I have to grudgingly use an IDE because I have no idea how to update the 78 other manifest/gradle/workspace/resource/etc. files based on the 1 file I change and the IDE takes care of the magic, as much as I hate that way of working.

  • nucleardog 9 months ago

    You can have your cake and eat it too.

    There are some really great vim plugins for Sublime Text, including one that uses NeoVim. For me, Sublime Text is basically Vim with an nice UI and some IDE features built in. And Goto Anything. I wouldn't want to live without Goto Anything.

  • Lio 9 months ago

    I don't want to put anyone off they're favourite editor but you can have all of that cake (well maybe not all the eye candy) in Vim/NeoVim.

    e.g. Goto anything you can use the Ctrl-P plugin.

  • bowmessage 9 months ago

    They're always inferior editing experiences, these vim bolt-on plugins. Missing key features like 'jk' mash escaping and other remapping support.

  • nucleardog 9 months ago

          { "keys": ["j", "k"],       "args": {"key": "<esc>"},    "context": [{ "key": "setting.actual_intercept", "operand": true }], "command": "actual_keypress" },
    That, in your Sublime keymap, should map jk to escape if you're using the ActualVim plugin.

    On the backend, it's using NeoVim... So it's literally just vim. You can even use vim plugins. There really shouldn't be any missing features.

  • bowmessage 9 months ago

    Oh! Didn't know this. Thanks.

  • cletus 9 months ago

    Whereas I view vim as simply a necessary evil and I mean "necessary" in the sense that I want to edit something over ssh.

    Bret Viktor's oft-quoted "Inventing on Principle" talk touches on this subject where a lot of research has shown that bimodal editors are worse. While I can't argue for how true that statement is, it's certainly been my experience. I always find it jarring to think I'm in command mode but I'm actually in edit mode or vice versa. Any vim user has had the experience of pasting text in command mode. I just absolutely hate bimodal editors.

    Additionally, staunch vim (and emacs) users I know seem to spend an inordinate amount of time screwing around with plugins to get some pale version of behaviour you get out the box on any halfway decent IDE or even text editor.

    I feel the same way about learning yet another series of keyboard shortcuts for, say, tmux/screen.

    You could argue the mouse is slower. I'm not sure if this actually holds up to empirical measurement (or at least not to the degree that's claimed) but the point is, the barrier for entry is so much lower. You can just click around and find things. If you find yourself doing something a lot, you can find out what the keyboard shortcut is.

    Thus you don't need to spend 50 hours upfront on a GUI editor.

  • colecut 9 months ago

    It's possible to go overkill with learning tons of unnecessary shortcuts, but in my opinion all you really need for tmux is attach, detach, split horizontal, split vertical, fullscreen.

    5 shortcuts is a paltry investment for a pretty sweet gain.

    And unlike an IDE, this can be readily available on any machine you SSH into. Which is also what makes VIM so handy.

  • mrkgnao 9 months ago

    From the point of view of "onboarding" (aka barriers to entry), as you say, point-and-click is miles ahead of the unfriendly-at-first-glance Vim.

    But I'd like to say that I cannot honestly recall an instance where I was in normal mode and ended up pasting something -- I assume you mean Ctrl-V-ing and having the paste interpreted as commands? -- once I got used to it after leaving Sublime Text, which I'd say took me a couple of weeks of hating myself. It's a matter of how much effort one thinks it makes sense to put into learning the editor, but IME there is a significant payoff, even if it is hard-won.

    I'm not sure if it's harder for some people to internalize (which is by no means a value judgment; it's why Emacs/ST/Atom/whatever exist and are powerful) but once that is done, one never gets confused about what mode you're in simply because one is almost never in insert mode! "Probabilistically" speaking, you are in insert mode for 0 time. ;)

    In any case, I don't hate non-bimodal editors, just hope that the subset of those using them who have not seen Vim for what it is yet do so quickly. (And, of course, there are those who are genuinely repulsed by modal editing, and that's fine!)

    I can't speak to "inordinate amount of time screwing around with plugins": I have a plugin for each language I use, and perhaps four or five others. The rest of my init.vim (I use Neovim) is about ... 30 lines long? It's my experience that most (Neo)vi(m) users use little of the power of plain vi -- I know that because I myself was like that for almost three or four years after I started using Vim. (This is ignoring, e.g. large Java projects, where IDE-style code navigation is basically a requirement if you want to get anything done.) But there is definitely a culture where a customized-to-the-hilt editor is seen as something to be proud of, and why shouldn't it? It's what you "live in", isn't it? :)

  • nicoburns 9 months ago

    The 'micro' text editor is a fantastic vim replacement for SSH editing. It's a text-ui like vim, but it has mouse support (for selecting text, etc), and keyboard shortcuts that match bio stands, ctrl-s for save, ctrl-q for quit, etc.

  • Lio 9 months ago

    Worth noting, Vim has full mouse support for scrolling, selecting text, resizing windows, etc. in the terminal and when working over SSH.

  • vacri 9 months ago

    > You could argue the mouse is slower. I'm not sure if this actually holds up to empirical measurement

    It is slower, and does hold up to empirical measurement. Yes, if you want 'ease of onboarding', then vim is not for you. It's a powerful tool for professionals, and like a lot of such tools, it requires some training. No-one ever complains that Photoshop requires training, yet a brand new user to Photoshop is completely befuddled and it takes a long time before they're proficient.

  • todd8 9 months ago

    I've owned Photoshop since it was distributed on diskettes and I'm still befuddled every time I need its impressive power. (I'm not a professional graphics/photography person so I use the program only a few times per year now.)

    I think this is a really good analogy to using pro-level text editing tools (e.g. Emacs or Vi). A mouse is great for poking around menus and operating sliders in a new or unfamiliar program, but Emacs and especially Vim are so fast to use without a mouse that it pains me to watch other programmers editing while using one.

    ST is a fine editor, and I use IntelliJ for Java, but I've already spent the time (years) learning Emacs. Is it worth it for me to start over? No. I use IntelliJ for Java programming, but I use only its basic Emacs keybindings and the mouse for everything else (befuddled like I am in Photoshop).

  • bowmessage 9 months ago

    You don't know the right vim / emacs users then :)

  • 9 months ago
  • xapata 9 months ago

    Counter-example: I used vim for years, then switched to Sublime.

  • marcuslager 9 months ago

    I bought a license simply beacuse Sublime Text was the only editor that could open a wikipedia json data dump. I installed many editors before I more than willingly paid for Sublime.

  • geerlingguy 9 months ago

    For me, same thing: no other editor gives me the decent UI of a GUI-based editor, but with the speed of vim when working with large text files (e.g. 10MB+).

    I will often use sed or other CLI tools to parse through giant files (1GB+), but sublime only takes a short bit to load in a pretty hefty file, or a do regex search across entire projects with multiple-GB of files, and it works natively on Mac and Windows, so even when I'm forced to work on something on my Windows 10 laptop, I can be productive.

    Well worth whatever I paid for it 4 years ago.

  • dabockster 9 months ago

    It has almost all of the features of the Electron based editors (aka Atom) but with a C++ backend instead of HTML/JS toilet water. So you have all the customization you could ever want with the speed of low level code.

  • chj 9 months ago

    It's a dead simple editor, comparing to VIM or Emacs (both I used a lot). Everything behaves just as you would expect.

    And it's fast, it's small, and it's got a lot of packages. What more do you want?

  • uji 9 months ago

    Terminal support? To be fair, sublime text is great and I use it sometimes, but if your job requires you to work over ssh then vim definitely beats all modern editors.

  • chj 9 months ago

    Yeah, I agree. That's when I use vim/emacs.

  • kylebebak 9 months ago

    Speed and stability, search, command palette, file navigation, Goto.

    And the excellent Python plugin API, which has made the plugin ecosystem so vibrant. Here's one I wrote, https://github.com/kylebebak/Requester, an HTTP client that goes toe to toe with Paw and Postman on features and outdoes them on usability.

    I couldn't have have written something like this for any other editor, or any other platform.

  • paradite 9 months ago

    I think it is in a similar situation as JavaScript. It is not strictly better than its competitors, but it still manages to attract an entire community of people[1] to contribute actively to the project and its popularity.

    [1] https://packagecontrol.io/stats

  • 9 months ago
  • rublev 9 months ago

    Nothing is faster for me when opening gargantuan text files. It's never broken for me and never lagged either. I think that's pretty impressive, not to mention the customizability options.

  • dexterdog 9 months ago

    Define gargantuan. I just opened a 900MB CSV and it choked part-way through and eventually opened after about a minute. Windows 10, 8GB RAM and running on an SSD.

    Not to mention if you hit ctrl-f and search for something in the file. Another lock-up for a few minutes while it tries to figure out highlighting. This is something I've reported to them. I have never considered Sublime to be a good handler of large files.

  • rublev 9 months ago

    Opened a 1GB text file on MacOS 15gb ram and SSD.

  • cdelsolar 9 months ago

    > Windows

  • dexterdog 9 months ago

    Same problem on my mac with 16GB RAM and also an SSD

  • zerr 9 months ago

    Agree, yet even SlickEdit - which costs several times more, is still running strong. I wonder what kind of audience pays for it.

  • p0nce 9 months ago

    The small things are really well done.

  • bitwize 9 months ago

    It's an organic, artisanal text editor lovingly hand-carved from gap-buffer wood by craftsmen from a remote Tibetan village. A steal at thrice the price!

  • yoodenvranx 9 months ago

    What about the idea to sell 'silver/gold/diamond supporter' licences for 100/200/300$ to people who _really_ love your software?

    I am not even talking about adding some special features, just enable people to pay more than the normal price and perhaps just add a nice 'Thanks for your extra support' badge to the 'Info' menu.

  • Beltiras 9 months ago

    Buy licenses and donate to your local high school.

  • saagarjha 9 months ago

    My local high school will refuse them. The computer science classes use Geany because it “builds character” and anything that looks remotely like an IDE apparently “does too much work for students”.

  • mstade 9 months ago

    This is great, I will have my accountant look into how I can do this. Thanks for the suggestion!

  • virgil_disgr4ce 9 months ago

    Excellent, excellent suggestion.

  • JohnKacz 9 months ago

    Or give the diamond supporters the ability to vote on features. That may not be something Jon and Will would want though.

  • yoodenvranx 9 months ago

    That is exactly what I would avoid. Don't add any special features to it (vote for features, faster support responses) because that will take time from normal development. Just clearly state: "This software cost x$. And if you love it so much that you would pay double the price then you are free to do so."

  • UseStrict 9 months ago

    Totally. I bought my license in 2013 and just realized that I didn't even have to pay the 3.0 license upgrade fee! I have used Sublime daily for almost 5 years now and I almost feel guilty for paying so little. I'd be more than happy to pay for a future 4.0 upgrade fee now.

  • sundvor 9 months ago

    Bought mine November 2012. Just paid my US$11 now. Far too cheap; but... good on you Jon! Thanks for all the effort - you rock!

  • looki 9 months ago

    Same here. I honestly didn't expect this, that's a bargain.

  • reificator 9 months ago

    As a former paying user of Sublime, I find this interesting, because their pricing seems to be right on target all around.

    If there was a subscription available that offered some amount of extra features, I probably wouldn't have purchased anything at all.

  • mstade 9 months ago

    So many nasty replies. :o(

    (Some pretty great replies too – thanks!)

    I'm not a ST dev, I have no financial interests in ST becoming more expensive or changing to a (for the company) more lucrative business model. I have tried alternative editors, anything from vi and emacs to VSCode and Atom, but nothing hits the marks for me as ST does. It has – in my opinion – great UX, its speed and efficiency is unmatched in the GUI editor space, and my favorite feature: it has rock solid buffer persistence.

    I can't tell how many times ST has saved me from system crashes and just me being an idiot and restarting everything before saving anything, or removing a file but ST keeping a buffer. I've come to rely on this, and it's rock solid. Not once in the years since I started using it (I believe I bought my first license in 2012) have I encountered a situation where ST lost my data. I've never experienced this with any other editor (I'm sure vi and emacs can do this, but in years of trying, I can't come to grips with their UX – they're just not for me) and this feature alone has paid for the price of admission for me, many many times over.

    In short – I don't care that there are FOSS alternatives. I don't care that there are alternatives that are "better" by some measure. Until they can match these three things, in increasing order of importance, they will never compete with ST for me:

    - Great UX

    - Speed and efficieny

    - Rock solid buffer persistance, even for unsaved files

    Someone in this thread suggested I buy licenses and donate to a local high school. I'm going to seriously look into this as a viable way to both support the company producing ST, as well as hopefully enabling kids to learn programming, or write novels, or whatever they want to do with the software.

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    Agreed. I am a very appreciative Sublime user as well and want to ensure your business is successful.

    I started with Textmate during the Rails craze and transitioned to Sublime due to the portability of themes etc. I think I'm still using my 10 year old TM theme.

    Thank you for the continued dedication to this project.

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    Update: Turns out I bought Sublime in 2012 so I was due to pay the $30 upgrade fee. Gladly! Just completed the process.

  • pvg 9 months ago

    Amusingly, your 10 year old TM theme probably shows different/inaccurate colours than it did in TM unless you went to the trouble of converting it to sRGB for Sublime.

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    I'm out now but it looks identical. I'll share a screenshot and download link when I'm back! It's my favorite.

  • pvg 9 months ago

    Here's an interminable github issue thread about it. https://github.com/SublimeTextIssues/Core/issues/880

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    Update: It's called Made of Code.

    Here is the screenshot: https://i.imgur.com/JvDEBk7.png

    Here is the theme: http://fl-mwhalen-dev.s3.amazonaws.com/Made%20of%20Code.tmTh...

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    Please explain your wizardry.

  • pvg 9 months ago

    It's just your theme opened in TextMate and Sublime. Sublime displays the AppleRGB colorspace colors (the default in the original TextMate) as sRGB. So they come out off. Check out the linked github thread for the gory/inconclusive details.

  • vanadium 9 months ago

    This was the easiest upgrade to consider in my career; $30 is nothing compared to the value and ecosystem around Sublime Text.

    I'd entertain such a model as OP to ensure the ongoing viability of the app.

  • danso 9 months ago

    I concur with this. I'm appreciative of Atom -- and recommend it to folks who aren't professional programmers and can't imagine paying for a text editor -- and I've heard similar great things about VS Code, but ST and its ecosystem has just been so dependable for me. It was inconvenient to switch over from TextMate to ST initially, but ended up being a great move overall. I haven't yet seen anything on the horizon that would seem like the next phase from ST for me.

  • baldfat 9 months ago

    I left VIM after 20 year to VS Code. I find that the ecosystem at VS Code to be the best I have ever seen. Great job by Microsoft and I use it on my Linux box all day.

  • yodsanklai 9 months ago

    Vim code in VS code works very well (and integrates commonly used vim extension such as 'surround'). You can have the best of both worlds.

  • baldfat 9 months ago

    I should have stated that I still use VIM mode and bindings. It is the reason why I am there. I tried Sublime, Atom and other text editors and VS Code's VIM mode was on par.

  • computerex 9 months ago

    I have tried vscode and vim plugin but found it to be noticeably less responsive than vim.

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    Is it built in, or is it a plugin?

  • yodsanklai 9 months ago


  • inamberclad 9 months ago

    I like it except that it installed it's own apt sources for updates without telling me, and that rubbed me the wrong way.

  • baldfat 9 months ago

    I believe that would be distro dependent. On my Linux base I just use the RPM until I added a repo.

  • 8draco8 9 months ago

    Yes. They could make some kind of small cloud service to pay for on a monthly/yearly basis. I would gladly pay for a service that would allow me to share my Sublime settings, addons and projects across all my Sublime installations. This can be done either way but I would happily pay Sublime devs for that.

  • mtw 9 months ago

    You should buy multiple licenses of Sublime Text 3.0

    I'm in a situation where if I had $10 or $80 extra, I would use it to buy baby supplies, not software. Many others are in the same situation, or worse (thinking of those in developing countries where $80 represent a week's worth of savings).

  • newscracker 9 months ago

    I agree on the point that useful software/service providers must have a sustainable business model, but I see your point about $80 being too cheap as just one data point (not that you were claiming otherwise, and you did appreciate the value that you get). There are many people for whom spending $80 every few years may be a bigger burden too. Subscriptions, without significantly lower per year prices, also favor the ones for whom these aspects don't matter as much.

    I just wanted to put these points across since a single price probably may not well serve all user classes and the developer/company.

  • satysin 9 months ago

    I would also like if the developer would agree to release the source code under a FLOSS license should he find working on Sublime Text is no longer worthwhile for him (could be financial but could also just be because he has lost interest in developing it, etc).

  • uoaei 9 months ago

    Feel free to donate licenses to university students!

  • veidr 9 months ago

    I don't feel like Sublime Text has the development momentum to justify the subscription model.

    That isn't necessarily bad; it's a great editor and I've been happy to pay for all versions of it.

    But if I am paying an ongoing, continual fee, I expect rapid delivery of updates and new features. I pay for an IDE from JetBrains, and they deliver solid incremental improvements and bug fixes, continuously. So I feel the continual fee is acceptable.

    Sublime Text is known for going on hiatus for months at a stretch, with no or negligible updates. That would irritate me as a paying subscriber to the software; it doesn't bug me when I pay a lump sum for the big milestone releases.

  • halfnibble 9 months ago

    I think I'm going to start buying licenses for my interns and students. It's an investment in our future. Today's interns and students are tomorrow's senior devs. Best to start them off proper.

  • thesagan 9 months ago

    Same here, I get wayyyyyy more than $80 of usage out of this software. I'm very very appreciative of the great work that has gone into this product and don't want it going any place!

  • hashkb 9 months ago

    I think the price is fair given their competition is foss.

  • nateweiss 9 months ago

    Agreed, I just paid my upgrade fee and it seemed too small.

    I feel ST could have a checkbox during checkout to add an additional $50 or something in that range. "I'd like to be a supporter for an extra $50". I'm pretty sure I would opt-in to that, but maybe I'm just saying that now because there isn't such an option....

  • hopeless 9 months ago

    Yes, happy to pay more often. Or just have smaller releases. It must have been years since I last paid for Sublime

  • anindha 9 months ago

    You could buy some additional licenses and donate them to someone.

  • cdnsteve 9 months ago

    Also, I don't see Sublime in the MacOS App store. I'd suggest it get added there, even if you have to charge more due to the percentage that Apple takes.

  • tempay 9 months ago

    I suspect it wouldn't work with the sandboxing required for the mac app store.

  • Karunamon 9 months ago

    The sand boxing requirements plus STs plugins may make that a non starter.

  • cdnsteve 9 months ago

    Ah right. Thanks

  • azeirah 9 months ago

    Honestly, I'm in. I'm absolutely dependent on Sublime Text for my workflow. I don't mind paying more for it /whatsoever/

  • wslh 9 months ago

    Would a crowdfunding campaign help to fund a product like Sublime Text which has a lot of traction? I think so.

  • eberkund 9 months ago

    It has worked in the past, for example: I would consider the recent FontAwesome 5 kickstarter campaign a huge success both from a funding point of view and the backers getting what they wanted. This was only really possible in my opinion due to the reputation Dave Gandy built up by releasing the open source version of FA prior. One needs only to look at the myriad of failed software kickstarters for examples of what happens when a unknown person who hasn't proven they are capable of delivering what people want tries the same thing.

  • laxk 9 months ago

    Probably they just need to add a Donate button for people who wants give more than license fee only.

  • vim_wannabe 9 months ago

    The first thing I did after Ulysses went the way of subscription was get a refund from App Store. :)

  • Volt 9 months ago

    Do you think that TextMate fell by the wayside because of an unsustainable business model?

  • geerlingguy 9 months ago

    It fell by the wayside because 2.0 was the HL3 of text editor releases, IMO. Open sourcing it was too little, too late. Even though Sublime Text has had long periods of inactivity, the beta releases every quarter or two were just enough to keep people who loved the editor hooked. TextMate lost people like me because there was, for a long time, zero indication it would continue being developed.

  • amorphid 9 months ago

    Encourage them to set up a Patreon page? Do people use Patreon for software projects?

  • makk 9 months ago

    Or keep the current model as is and add an optional recurring donation somewhere.

  • loop0 9 months ago

    You can always buy more licenses and give away to other people. :)

  • joemaller1 9 months ago

    Just buy another license.

  • soegaard 9 months ago

    Buy a copy for a friend!

  • 2439u23uro 9 months ago

    Oh get fucked. The last thing we need is more subscription models!

  • goosh453 9 months ago

    nice try sublime dev :>

  • lopatin 9 months ago

    Still the gold standard as far as I'm concerned. It seems to be the only editor that focuses on my happiness by providing a flawless text editing experience. It feels like using a modern iPhone compared to a 2005 Android phone (and yes, the Android phone was probably more extensible).

  • khamisiyah 9 months ago

    A small correction: the first Android phone was released in 2008.

  • jeffbax 9 months ago

    I think they were meant to release earlier, but had to "go back to the drawing board", so to speak https://www.technobuffalo.com/2011/10/27/android-before-and-...

  • lopatin 9 months ago

    touché. Maybe OS X vs Ubuntu Desktop is a better comparison. (Can you tell I like Apple products?)

  • anderber 9 months ago

    This is an interesting comparison. Curious as what you think makes OS X better. From what I understand Ubuntu is faster, uses less resources and is much more extensible. All things know to be Sublime-like.

  • jeffbax 9 months ago

    *macOS ;)

    For me, the UI paradigms are certainly more cohesive… but most importantly I don't think any platform has the quality software that OS X has when it comes to attention to detail/usability. Like many with Sublime, I'm happy to pay for other commercial software if its notably better than the free options.

    Ubuntu is probably leaner, but in an age of i7s and 16GB ram not sure that matters as much. OS X is aggressive at using what you can throw at it, which generally has made things feel faster than me, but I came from Windows in 2004.

    It generally strikes the balance of what I deem the finest commercial software, with a very great open source ecosystem 90% as good as Linux. Makes for a very good dev environment, and the hardware is unbeatable (which is made possible by the software integration)

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    I agree with all of this except

    > the hardware is unbeatable

    The new macbook pros are gobsmackingly expensive in much of the world, marginally less so in the US. Apple's obdurate refusal to use touch screens puts them far behind the mainstream leading edge now. I understand their reasoning, but haven't yet met anyone with a touchscreen laptop who would go back to using one without.

    And the coup de grace is the new fake keyboard, which is unusable for all-row touch typists. My next laptop will most likely be a Dell XPS 15 with one flavour or other of Linux. I'd prefer macOS, but the hardware isn't worth living with.

  • Zelizz 9 months ago

    In my opinion, Linux desktop environments have historically been missing small but important details, like proper escape angles in menus, and comprehensive / nicely organized settings pages, adding friction to the user experience. My more recent experience with Debian and Ubuntu has been much better though.

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    Cohesiveness. Everything feels like it fits together; that it was meant to work together. There's also the focus on the user that OS X is known for.

  • evv 9 months ago

    I see the author, jskinner, is hanging out on this thread!

    Have you ever considered open-sourcing SLT? This is your only route to immortalize this amazing piece of software. I'm sure you'd receive immense community contributions and widespread support. If you switch to a donation model + enterprise support plans, I think you're likely to earn greatly more than you currently do.

    I love SLT and have used it throughout my career, but I still feel more comfortable depending on Atom because I know it will be supported by the community in the event that something bad happens with the ownership. If you don't open-source SLT, I sadly believe that open alternatives like Atom will outlive it.

  • RazrFalcon 9 months ago

    >I know it will be supported by the community

    They won't. Projects like Atom and VSCode thrives because they have big companies behind them. Remove them - and the project will die.

    There are tons of abandoned text editors on GiHub.

  • Jarwain 9 months ago

    If I were in his shoes, I would open-source the project once I decided I wanted to stop working on it, or when I feel I've made enough, or have it baked into my will to open source the project if the truly unfortunate happens.

    Of course, with a team backing the project that changes the dynamic a bit

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    "If you switch to a donation model + enterprise support plans, I think you're likely to earn greatly more than you currently do."

    I'm curious as to what your evidence to back this statement up is. As is, most donation-ware ends up getting next to nothing in donations.

  • ksec 9 months ago

    Sometimes I wonder why there isn't a model, where its Author put up after Number of Copies sold, it will be open sourced.

    Of Coz it wont be a small amount. It could be 25,000 copies. But then lot of companies, whom may like Sublime, could spend and join the race.

  • stanmancan 9 months ago

    If you spend years taking the risk and building a piece of software; why give it away once it's successful?

  • nirvdrum 9 months ago

    Blender sorta did that. It was a closed source project that the authors said they would open source if the community raised €100,000. It succeeded and the software was subsequently made open source.

  • captainmuon 9 months ago

    It doesn't even have to be proper open source - just source open! Just dump the source and say people may not sell it, but they may study it and contribute back.

    You're not loosing any income - honest people will continue to buy the license, and those who are not honest or cannot afford it will continue to not buy a license. But people will be put at ease about the bus factor. We will learn a lot about how to produce a snappy app with a multiplatform toolkit. And I'm sure people will contribute back great features.

  • jhasse 9 months ago

    I guess many people won't contribute then.

  • aloisdg 9 months ago

    The lack of Open Source is my struggle too. I really want to use it, but I want to be able to browse the code.

  • Acalyptol 9 months ago

    Atom will die with Electron in a not so distant future.

  • jrwiegand 9 months ago

    ST2 was the first text editor that really caught my eye. They have also been great with allowing users to permanently "trial" the software. I moved to ST3 beta as soon as it came out and the transition was mostly smooth.

    Then VSCode came out and I loved every second of it. It does take more up more memory and is a bit slower but they are quality software and the difference to me is negligible. I cannot see myself going back. SublimeHQ lost me when they stopped updating the software regularly. I know it was rock solid software but the project seemed to be a standstill and VSCode grabbed my attention. Now it has many more features and better support from MS. I cannot imagine a reason to switch unless ST3 gets the same level of love.

  • giancarlostoro 9 months ago

    I gotta say their new homepage looks like eye candy:


  • donatj 9 months ago

    On my iPad however the text is so large as to be difficult to read.

  • wbond 9 months ago

    Unfortunately I don't have an iPad to test with. Is it zooming to 480px wide?

  • SippinLean 9 months ago

    Indeed it's quote large: https://i.imgur.com/6vNoC2d.png

    If you have a Mac laying around the office install Xcode and the Simulator to test and debug iOS devices.

  • Jare 9 months ago

    I have no idea why you got the downvotes. Also, you can check it out with the device emulator in chrome devtools.

  • overcast 9 months ago

    Yep, no nonsense, clearly read, shows you what you need to know.

  • Raphmedia 9 months ago

    New skin but pretty similar to the old one. I've always liked the preview which shows the useful shortcuts.

  • losvedir 9 months ago

    Heh, I was confused at first before remembering that what I have been using for these past years was a "beta". Unfortunately, I guess that means all these great new features in the announcement are ones that I'm already completely familiar with. But I suppose I should still go and upgrade my license. It's been my daily driver editor for more than 5 years now, and it's easily worth the $30 to upgrade my ST2 license!

  • AdmiralAsshat 9 months ago

    Bar none, my favorite editor. I try to use Vim only sometimes to make sure I keep those commands in shape, but Sublime remains for hardcore work. It breaks my heart that it's closed source.

    I do wonder sometimes how much the app makes and/or how much someone would have to pay the developer to open source it.

  • theHazardMan 9 months ago

    There is "VIntage Mode" for ST, but unfortunately it's not entirely accurate and also doesn't support some commands. VSCode's VIM plugin is more complete.

  • lunixbochs 9 months ago

    Self-plug: https://github.com/lunixbochs/actualvim uses NeoVIM to give you every Vim command/motion in Sublime, and some of the Vim UI (waiting on Sublime/Neovim changes for the rest). VSCodeVim is using it as a reference to drive part of their roadmap.

  • e_proxus 9 months ago

    There's also the new Sublime Six which is very promising: http://www.sublimesix.com

  • 9 months ago
  • AdmiralAsshat 9 months ago

    Correct, I've got Vintageous installed, which is a more feature-complete implementation of VIM's keybindings and its "ex" mode.

    It's still not exactly the same as using pure VIM, since some of the commands overlap with Sublime commands, and I tend to use a hybrid of both (for instance, Sublime's Ctrl-D command to make multiple cursors, which is incredibly useful when I'm editing HTML and have to wrap several lines in anchor tags).

    Going into "pure VIM" is just to make sure I don't get too reliant on Sublime niceties, particularly as my day job requires spending a great deal of time SSH'd into random RHEL/CentOS boxes.

  • trishume 9 months ago

    There's also https://github.com/NeoVintageous/NeoVintageous, which is a maintained fork of Vintageous with some things cleaned up, and some bugs fixed.

  • 8draco8 9 months ago

    I think they finally faced the truth that over 90% of users was using "beta" version (actually their words and stats) and listened to some comments on HN. Good job guys! I'm glad that my favourite editor is finally out.

    EDIT: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=14424220

  • FichteFoll 9 months ago

    There is more that goes into declaring a release as "stable" than just having it not crash.

    For example, take the updated homepage, the licence upgrade process, the proper integration into linux package managers and more.

    Couple that with the perception of users of things being "stable" having more reliability and them more likely trying it out and finding rare bugs or issues. Just looking at the forum today revealed a couple issues that nobody on the dev releases has discovered or reported.

    That said, you still have to release a stable version every once in a while and they knew that. Unfortunately it took longer than anticipated.

  • kabdib 9 months ago

    I bought ST2 in 2013, and I'm a littled bummed they pushed the "your license works for ST3" back that far. They deserve more; I might buy another copy anyway.

    (My favorite editor is an Emacs clone called Epsilon. It hasn't been updated in a decade, but it still works great. On the other hand, it hasn't been updated in a decade and I think the writing is on the walls, and I'll have to move to something else. 25 years of muscle memory are hard to deal with, though. I'd definitely throw some money the author's way if he ever decided to do a new release).

  • secure 9 months ago

    As per http://www.lugaru.com/, they released an evaluation version of epsilon on 2017-09-01, so just 12 days ago.

  • kabdib 9 months ago

    Steve refreshes the monthly eval (I assume it's got a time-based fuse baked in). So we know he's still alive :-)

    Epsilon is still a fantastic tool and you can customize the crap out of it, but there are some things (like multiple native windows) that you can't do, that I'd really like to have. Ah well.

  • 9 months ago
  • eptakilo 9 months ago

    I primarily use VSCode as my editor but I used Sublime back in the days.

    I haven't touched it in a while. How do these two editors compare lately?

  • reificator 9 months ago

    I'm in the same boat, though I find it unlikely that I would go back to Sublime at this point.

    VSCode is free, (mostly) MIT, has a unified debugger, great git support, integrated terminal emulator, and a nice healthy extension community.

    Sublime is cheap for how often you'll use it, but not free. It's proprietary. Git support even with paid plugins is lacking, especially compared to VS Code.

    I'm glad I bought Sublime when I did, but I'm also glad I found VSCode when I did. If there's a choice between FOSS and proprietary, and the FOSS project already works better, the proprietary option is unlikely to make a comeback for me.

  • yodsanklai 9 months ago

    Same here. I switched from Sublime to VSCode a few weeks ago after reading some comments here on HN. I don't think I will go back to Sublime for the reasons you mentioned. I also have the feeling that thanks to a fast increasing community the extensions are more polished (in particular, I like the vim mode better).

    Sublime is indeed faster and more lightweight but that's not enough for me to keep using it.

  • bsimpson 9 months ago

    Really? One of the things that has kept me on Sublime is SublimeGit. It's fantastic.

  • tonydanza 9 months ago

    I'd check out GitSavvy for sublime, it wipes the floor with the VSCode VCS

  • dham 9 months ago

    Sublime is still the fastest(opens instantly), and personally it looks better than VSCode with the new adaptive themes. Font rendering on MacOS is native in Sublime instead of the fake blurry stuff you get with Electron.

  • gcp 9 months ago

    Font rendering on MacOS is native in Sublime instead of the fake blurry stuff you get with Electron.

    Wheee, I'm not the only one bothered by this! It's bad on Windows too, though Linux is fine. It affects all Electron based programs, including Chrome itself.

  • yodsanklai 9 months ago

    It is slightly faster, but I didn't notice any difference with the fonts.

  • ionised 9 months ago

    'slightly' is a serious understatement

  • konart 9 months ago

    If we are talking about opening big files - Sublime times faster than VSC and miles faster than Code, which still fails at files bigger then 10mb often.

  • bchang55 9 months ago

    VSC recently put in a large file feature. Which disables many of the standard text editing features to open up these files faster.

    I'm not sure if this addresses files bigger than 10mb though.

  • konart 9 months ago

    I'm using VCS for some time now (and was at the time of the previous comment), but it's still slow when compared. They did a great job and left Atom (I ment Atom when I said Code, lol) behind, but there is still a huge room for improvement.

  • faaq 9 months ago

    Yeah, it does and pretty well in latest releases.[0]

    [0] - https://github.com/Microsoft/vscode/issues/6474#issuecomment...

  • pkrefta 9 months ago

    In terms of opening speed at least - it still crushed both VSCode & Atom.

  • SketchySeaBeast 9 months ago

    I think it really depends on what you're using them for. I know I use both every day. I find myself using VSCode for more of my coding (taking advantage of intellisense and the built in debugger for my python work), while I find that Sublime has a much better "find in files" (as we use CVS for version control), and its general better for opening one-off files or lengthy debug logs with its amazing speed, and having enough respect to not leave little .vscode folders everywhere you tinker.

  • marsrover 9 months ago

    I downloaded Sublime 3 to try it out, just now. The first thing I did was install Vintageous. I hit `{` and the cursor didn't move.

    I love Sublime and used it for many years. It's fast, it looks good, and it's a great editor. It's hard to find an extension ecosystem like VSCode, though. I doubt I'll be returning to Sublime.

  • wedowhatwedo 9 months ago


    "Vintageous has been discontinued."

    I wouldn't blame the problem you had on Sublime. I can start up Sublime with all my plugins, press '{' and it works as expected.

  • rdavis 9 months ago

    Check out NeoVintageous [0]. It's the continuation of Vintageous and adds some great features.

    [0] https://github.com/NeoVintageous/NeoVintageous

  • SippinLean 9 months ago

    For front-end web development, OOTB VSCode is much better, in terms of features (though you could probably get ST to be that way with a number of plugins).

    ST is still a lot faster, but now that VSCode has introduced multi-folder workspaces there aren't a lot of features I miss anymore.

  • alexashka 9 months ago

    Sublime was the text editor for web dev because there wasn't a nice, free IDE.

    VSCode is that IDE - long live Sublime.

    It'll take a while to switch over but the writing is on the wall as far as I'm concerned - Sublime will be fondly remembered for it's novel features.

  • cdelsolar 9 months ago

    Ok sure. I just immediately paid the (underpriced) $30 for the license upgrade.

  • dham 9 months ago

    Love Sublime Text. Haven't been able to switch to any of the Electron editors because of the horrible font rendering on Mac(Chrome issue). One note: Jon needs to show the new adaptive theme with matching title bar for MacOS on the main page.

  • provemewrong 9 months ago

    > One note: Jon needs to show the new adaptive theme with matching title bar for MacOS on the main page.

    Wow, that's nice! Since it's not the default, if you hadn't mentioned it, I wouldn't even know about it.

  • jrochkind1 9 months ago

    What with being in beta for so long, I expected the actual 3.0 to be much like the (last beta) that I had been using. But there are significant changes to the UI, that I'll have to get used to or figure out how to customize (or wait for plugins to customize).

    What's with the "/" 'icon' next to many files? I'm not sure what it's supposed to indicate. As you can see in the screenshot in the announcement, some files have a rectangular 'document' icon (unrecognized format?), some have a '<>' icon (html/markdown-type format?), and some have a '/' icon... no idea? Is that supposed to mean "source code"? I am not a fan.

  • inopinatus 9 months ago

    /* means "comment starts here" to me. So now I instinctively feel the sidebar listing has commented out all my files. The fact it's an unterminated comment is blowing my syntax error fuses.

    I can override it rationally but there's some serious cognitive dissonance going on. It's configurable, although that's in the bowels of ST3 not in the usual settings, and this won't really help for pair work. Not a great decision I feel.

  • knodi123 9 months ago

    > What's with the "/" 'icon' next to many files?

    Hah. Just noticed that myself. It's the icon for "shell script", I think, which includes a wide variety of file types. If you cmd-shift-p and pick "install package", and then install "A File Icon", then that peculiarity is instantly and permanently replaced with meaningful icons (for all the types that I happen to use in my dayjob, at least).

  • jrochkind1 9 months ago

    Thanks! I think I already had A File Icon installed, but somehow it broke on upgrade to 3.0, I'll try reinstalling.

  • konart 9 months ago

    >But there are significant changes to the UI, that I'll have to get used to

    Just use the theme you prefer, nobody forces the default one on you, right?

  • schneidmaster 9 months ago

    Thrilled to finally see ST3 out of beta, it's like Christmas in September. I've used ST3 beta for literally thousands of hours since 2013, and ST2 before that. I've tried many newer options (Atom, VSCode, etc) but nothing has come close to matching the stability, speed, and reliability. I echo the other comments that I would gladly pay far more than the $70 I spent 5 years ago.

  • macrael 9 months ago

    May this be a thread where people post their favorite ST tweaks. Things that really make a difference day to day.

    I for one swapped the mapping of paste and paste and indent because I want the latter's behavior to be default.

    I also use a proportional font and love it. Something I can't get vim to do.

    I like gitgutter though it doesn't refresh properly always.

    What are your favorite plugins?

  • LesZedCB 9 months ago

    Material Theme. Best UI Theme in my opinion.


  • gwenzek 9 months ago

    GitSavvy + GitGutter GitSavvy is a really thought-out Git integration for easy staging/commiting/stashing. It's one of the things that make people say Wow when they see me work.

    Also I use a small plugin to add terminal commands to the command palette which is very useful. Can't remember is name though.

  • LesZedCB 9 months ago

    MarkdownEditing changes the syntax theme and adds really nice features that make reading and writing markdown a breeze.


  • macrael 9 months ago

    Ok, off mobile, here's a better list:

    AutoFileName is surprisingly useful, it autocompletes file names.

    Gitignored File Excluder is a bit of a hack but is very nice.

    I'd love to get sublime linter up and running, but I haven't yet.

  • cypher543 9 months ago

    I'm surprised the "minihtml" HTML/CSS engine is buried in the release notes. That sounds like an amazing little component and something that would be extremely useful for projects that don't want to embed an entire browser engine. Even if Sublime itself remained closed, I would love to see minihtml open sourced!

  • Finnucane 9 months ago

    I've been using ST 3 long enough that I forgot it was still technically beta.

  • ajoy39 9 months ago

    I found an old laptop I hadn't used in about 3 years, fired it up and quipped to my friends "Hah, this thing is so old it's still running the beta of ST3!"

  • herf 9 months ago

    I'm a daily user since 2012, and I'm glad they made me pay for the upgrade. Best editor ever.

    Sublime makes cross-platform development easy, and it's so much faster than the alternatives.

  • Varcht 9 months ago

    500+ comments and no mention of the touch bar support?

    Not really surprised, after 6 mos I don't think I've used the touch bar for anything other than mute / volume.

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    Perhaps because so many developers avoid the touch bar macbooks? Everyone I know here has been buying 15" mbpro refurbs to forestall the dreaded day (ie. touch bar or just abandon macs?)

  • tuananh 9 months ago

    $80 for something we make a living on is very reasonable.

  • mattl 9 months ago

    There's a real danger I think in relying on a proprietary software program for something so key as text editing. For many developers, their editor will be with them for their whole career. Proprietary software has a tendency to not stick around.

    I hope to see Sublime eventually released under a free software license. I'd donate to that project.

  • criddell 9 months ago

    It's not that hard to switch, especially for a developer that lives in the software. It might take a few days, but if your brain is still fairly plastic, you will adapt.

    If you are like my parents that can't get on the internet if the browser icon disappears from their desktop, then there might be a problem.

  • mahyarm 9 months ago

    Something I've realized is a lot of our habits transfer over from app to app. Most authors of new software make sure to follow the standard OS text editing conventions, and windows, linux & macos are all fairly similar.

    When you use emacs or vim, which import their 1970s / early 1980s OS conventions with their keyboard shortcuts, you realize you can be dropped into a very foreign 'defaults' context, and they can conflict.

  • mattl 9 months ago

    I must be like your parents. My brain feels hard wired to Emacs.

  • criddell 9 months ago

    Just out of curiosity, are you okay with that?

  • def0wt 9 months ago

    It's not just brain plasticity. I have literally tons of Vim customization code that would need to be migrated. It's doable, but definitely not "a few days" effort.

    Any disruption like this this will impact full-on on my ability to program fast. Even a 10% drop in productivity over an extended migration and learning period can translate into the thousands of $$$.

  • lfowles 9 months ago

    I'm not sure I've seen a text editor that was revolutionary enough that I would consider myself crippled if it didn't stick around.

  • noir_lord 9 months ago

    Editor no, IDE yes.

    I'd be able to function without intellij ultimate but it would be incredibly painful and I'd permanently be slower.

  • gkya 9 months ago

    Emacs? I'd either implement my own version / maintain my own fork or stop using computers.

  • lfowles 9 months ago

    I have a feeling that emacs/vim in some form are going to stick around longer than I'll care about using computers to edit text, so it wasn't even on my radar :)

  • gkya 9 months ago

    Oh if I didn't know that I wouldn't be able to sleep :)

  • mattl 9 months ago

    Me too. I wouldn't be able to do a lot of things quickly or well without Emacs.

  • dotancohen 9 months ago

    I used to think that, until I discovered the IDEA suite (PyCharm, PHPStorm, etc). And many devs use Windows as well. The OS is no less important than the text editor.

    I still use VIM often enough to stay proficient with it, mostly via SSH, but I'll happily use the closed source IDEA editors when they are available.

  • mattl 9 months ago

    > The OS is no less important than the text editor.

    Depends what you're doing, I suppose. If you're doing web development, Python, Ruby, PHP, C, JavaScript, etc... I don't think being on any particular OS is more important than your tools.

  • dotancohen 9 months ago

    Assuming that the tools run on any OS. Mac users especially seem to rely on tools available only on that platform.

  • Overv 9 months ago

    It's not like Sublime Text will suddenly stop working when the developers no longer release any updates.

  • Jach 9 months ago

    Probably not suddenly (unless there's DRM) but over time as other things change, sure. For instance there are plenty of Windows programs from the past, shareware or paid, that simply do not work on Windows 7 (let alone 10). Since they're proprietary nothing can be done. You might be able to emulate or use a VM and get it to run but not as a first class citizen.

  • mattl 9 months ago

    I suspect you're correct for Windows. For GNU/Linux and for Mac OS X, I wouldn't expect them to work after 2-3 years.

  • daemin 9 months ago

    It's easier to switch to another text editor than it is a search engine.

  • s73ver_ 9 months ago

    Given the plethora of alternatives, I feel that danger is largely overblown.

  • benbristow 9 months ago

    Not when Atom is pretty much the exact same thing but open-source and free.

  • bdcravens 9 months ago

    It's not "pretty much the exact same thing". ST is much faster and can handle very large files (say, CSVs in the hundreds of MBs) (as an aside, VS Code is much more performant than Atom)

  • Touche 9 months ago

    Editing large CSV files is something I do infrequently enough that I'll just use vim or whatever when that need arises. No need to choose my code editor based on that niche use-case.

  • andruby 9 months ago

    I use Atom, and it is not "pretty much the exact same thing".

  • arielserafini 9 months ago

    the exact same thing, slowed down to a crawl.

  • Manozco 9 months ago

    Then use Atom and don't comment The parent comment is valid for every software in the world, if you make your living with a 80$ software and you don't want to pay for it, you have big issues

  • Koshkin 9 months ago

    Parent has a point. (Legitimately not paying is a reasonable choice.)

  • ionised 9 months ago

    Open source, free and awful.

  • danieldk 9 months ago

    In my experience, the beta had been stellar for ages. But now I can finally drop the money on them ;).

    Purchased the upgrade license at and incredibly modest price of $30.

  • satysin 9 months ago

    Just checked and my upgrade cost is only $11 which I can't really argue with ;)

  • sbuttgereit 9 months ago

    My upgrade was $11 also, which seems way too little.

    Unless I'm way underestimating the subscriber base and associated economies of scale, and they really can afford to drive the upgrade rate by making it this cheap, seems like they're leaving a lot of cash on the table. That's actually a touch worrisome, naturally, because it reduces their ability to fund the business through downtimes and make investments into the product (etc). I depend on their product enough that I want their company to be robust and healthy, even if I have to pay more for that to happen. I know they only have a few people to pay today, and I could be wrong about my core assumption, but I don't think they're anywhere near what the market will bear.

    I would have paid almost four times as much without thinking myself poorly used. I originally bought sometime in late 2012 and used version 3 since sometime in 2013... which means I've been getting many of the benefits of the upgrade for close to four years. To be honest, I would have even understood if I had been asked to pay the full license fee again and would have done so without pause.

  • azemetre 9 months ago

    Where do you check? I'm still on the dev build which is one behind the release. I've tried updating in the editor but it states nothing is available. Seems odd that release is 3143 but dev is 3142.

  • corobo 9 months ago

    Mine was $0. Honestly thought I'd purchased it before the cutoff date, I can't even remember what I used to use so definitely worth the original price.

  • agentgt 9 months ago

    One of the reasons I still use both Emacs and Vim (yes I strangely use both) is because I can go execute them on a terminal (terminal, tmux, screen, etc).

    There are just so many times I need to SSH into a machine. I know Emacs has some remote file editing capabilities but for some reason I never liked it (I can't recall why now... I think it was the need to sudo).

    So I'm wondering what sublime text fans do for remote editing?

  • agladlad 9 months ago

    I'm fairly happy with the sshfs implementation provided by the FUSE project: https://github.com/osxfuse/sshfs/releases

    Once you set some flags like sshfs -o auto_cache,reconnect,defer_permissions,negative_vncache,noappledouble [email protected]:/ /path/to/local/ it's pretty robust.

    I can then edit files remotely but still use Sublime Text :)

  • jefurii 9 months ago

    > I know Emacs has some remote file editing capabilities but for some reason I never liked it (I can't recall why now... I think it was the need to sudo).

    Tramp (https://www.gnu.org/software/tramp/tramp-emacs.html) enables seamless remote editing over ssh/scp. By default it asks for your password all the time but you can cache that. Add to your ~/.emacs

      (require 'tramp)
      (setq tramp-default-method "scp")
      (setq password-cache-expiry 1800)
  • Rondom 9 months ago

    You probably should use public key authentication and ssh-agent.

  • Jemaclus 9 months ago

    I use vim on remote machines. I don't like it, but it does the job.

  • geerlingguy 9 months ago

    Most things are in git so work is local; for servers where I have ssh/sftp access I use Transmit to locally edit files using Sublime. It's usually seamless, unless you switch network connections in the middle of a save.

    But a lot of the time, I am running vim on the remote server... no simple substitute unless you install some sort of channel to be able to edit locally, or have it available via SFTP (especially with sudo, that's often not possible).

  • daveFNbuck 9 months ago

    Same solution as you, I use different editors in different contexts. You use Emacs and Vim, I use Sublime and Vim. I also edit locally and push my git branch to the remote server to test/run the code. I do that for most bigger changes and use vim to do smaller debugging changes.

    Some people use plugins to edit code over a tunnel using sftp. One of my coworkers edits locally and has aliases to rsync and run his code on the remote machine.

  • knodi123 9 months ago

    I was involuntarily forced to get the hang of vim back in my youth, and once I got over the learning curve, it's been an indispensable part of my toolkit. I waffle back and forth between sublime3, and tmux+vim, depending on how much I'm working locally vs. remotely

  • ricardobeat 9 months ago

    Open a terminal in another window. Moom/Magnet can handle automatic tiling on MacOS.

  • agentgt 9 months ago

    I'll have to try Moom. Right now I use SizeUp which isn't really a tiling manager but does provide some similar features. I use the tmux iterm integration which I must say is pretty badass. The iterm folks did a good job on that.

  • JCSato 9 months ago

    Finally bought a license a week ago - happiest I've been to spend money in a long time. Every other editor I use, I end up doing a bunch to try to make it more like Sublime. Congratulations to the team!

  • m_st 9 months ago

    Finally! I was using Build 3126 just about 2 hours ago and thinking that I haven't seen an update in a looong time. And there it is now. Congratulations to the team at Sublime HQ. Keep up the great work!

  • Mahn 9 months ago

    Tangential, but is everyone using Sublime comfortable with the sidebar on the left? Moving the sidebar to the right is the first thing I do in every editor, and the few times I tried Sublime I was surprised that for all its customizability that option doesn't exist. I was skimming through the changelog now and it seems like this is still true today.

  • ndh2 9 months ago

    What do you use the sidebar for?

    With Ctrl+P I've never needed the sidebar. Also I like it better if the entire screen is dark. So I'm always in fullscreen with the sidebar hidden.

  • Eleopteryx 9 months ago

    To browse my application's directory structure and optionally open a file to edit.

  • SippinLean 9 months ago

    If you wanna try VSCode it's as simple as

        "workbench.sideBar.location": "right"
  • notduncansmith 9 months ago

    I usually leave it closed unless I'm looking at a large/unfamiliar project. That said, any application I've ever used that offered a file tree placed it on the left and I never thought to question it. What's your motivation for it being on the right? Do you keep your desktop menu on the left or something?

  • koolba 9 months ago

    Depends on which monitor I have my editor in. I try to have the primary text for the editor in the middle so the nav switches left / right depending on the window location.

  • samueloph 9 months ago

    imagine living in a world where a good software like sublime text was free software...

    i know i know, to monetize selling free software is impossible (when people say they're monetizing selling free software they're actually selling services related to that free software, not the software itself), but one can dream...

    edit-> some people are confusing the term "free software", i'd like to clarify that i mean free as in free speech, not free as in free beer.

  • joncalhoun 9 months ago

    I honestly don't see any reason for Sublime Text to ever be more free than it is. The unlicensed version works as well as the paid version. The only real usability difference is that it asks you about a license every so often. If that reminder starts to annoy you it likely indicates that you are using ST often enough that you should pay for it.

    I don't understand why so many developers are willing to pay thousands to upgrade their hardware frequently, but then aren't willing to pay $80 (or $30 to upgrade) once every what, 5 years?, for software that they use in the realm of 30+hrs per week. Sublime text has easily saved me enough time to earn that back.

  • richeyryan 9 months ago

    OP means free as in speech as opposed to free as in beer. He would like the source to be available and to have the freedom to alter or redistribute it.

  • archagon 9 months ago

    Sublime is clearly worth the money, but I've been burned dozens of times by non-open-source software suddenly changing business models or getting bought out and then sundowned. On a longer timescale, it seems that open source is the only way to really keep software alive. I wouldn't be surprised if Emacs (or even Atom) outlived every commercial competitor in the field, including all the ones by the big players. And this is especially important with tools you use for your work!

    I wish we had a way of collectively and continuously funding open source software. Developers absolutely need to be paid, but it seems that software is better off when it's free.

    (With that said, Sublime is one of the few remaining non-open-source applications that I'm more than happy to buy.)

  • samueloph 9 months ago

    it's not that i ain't willing to pay for its license, its that i prefer it to be free software (the problem is that being free software they'll have to change a lot of things to monetize as much as if it isn't).

    about the reasons to be "more free" (as in free spech): collaborative development

  • codedokode 9 months ago

    Asking to buy is totally ok, but it also annoys the user by constant reminders that there is a newer version. And you cannot disable that.

  • meddlepal 9 months ago

    Isn't this exactly what JetBrains does with IntelliJ? The core is open source and more than enough for most users. I loved the tool so much, don't touch 90% of the features, but shell out money every month for the Ultimate license because great software is expensive to develop.

  • bdcravens 9 months ago

    Given the value to cost ratio, Sublime Text is essentially free. It costs about as much as most developers make in an hour or two. (Though I suspect if it was a large company it'd be a monthly subscription with cloud syncing and blah blah blah)

  • samueloph 9 months ago

    sorry, i mean free software as in free speech (eg: GPL), not free of charge

  • samoright 9 months ago

    There is no need to imagine. Emacs, Vim, Atom, Notepad++, etc. are all free software.

  • samueloph 9 months ago

    I use vim and atom, but most of my fellow developers don't want to use atom because it's heavy and slower than st, vim and emacs are out of question for them i think because things like the amount of work needed to prepare all the plugins to get the same functionality as the other tools.

  • dragandj 9 months ago

    Did you know that there are rich distributions that have done that for you? You can literally install those with a few simple steps and have fully functional super environment.

    Key words for Google search: Emacs Prelude, or Spacemacs

  • samueloph 9 months ago

    Didn't know that, thanks!

    TODO: search for vim equivalents

  • kronos29296 9 months ago

    Spacevim, vim-bootstrap, spf13, janus, vim-sensible (for sensible defaults for vim only).

  • govg 9 months ago

    Neovim has some good documentation on how to get started. Also, spacemacs has vim bindings if you wish, afaik.

  • jackmott 9 months ago

    I think we are supposing that electron apps aren't good software. But yes, emacs and vim still exist.

  • kstrauser 9 months ago

    I have nothing but good to say about Sublime Text. I love it. I bought a license for it. It's great.


    Its slow progress over the last few years reminded me of the risks of trusting proprietary software for my main work tools - especially when that software has a very low bus factor. That doesn't mean I won't use closed software or that I dislike the authors or anything, but that if I'm going to invest hundreds of hours into solidly learning and customizing something, I want to have faith that it's not going anywhere. That's why I waved a sad goodbye to the otherwise excellent Sublime Text and went back to [open source editor].

  • mattl 9 months ago

    yeah, my hope is that eventually they'll release it as free software. I'd be happy to donate at that point.

  • whipoodle 9 months ago

    There are so many free alternatives.

  • funnelsgun 9 months ago

    I bought my Sublime Text 2 license in 2012. 5 years later and its the best $80 I've ever spent. I'm so pleased Jon finished 3.0. Subscription upgraded.

  • mixmastamyk 9 months ago

    Looking at the screen shot, I still find it odd that, they use a white background for the file panel on the left. This has the effect of drawing the eye to it, making it the focal point of the window.

    That's the least important part of my editor honestly. Would expect it be a lot more low-key.

  • undershirt 9 months ago

    i had a similar complaint when the github navigation bar turned grey, but I just don't even notice it anymore. hard for me to discern UX principles here from user familiarity.

  • wbond 9 months ago

    Try the Adaptive theme!

  • tkubacki 9 months ago

    I love Sublime because it's rare example of quality linux app.

  • thecrumb 9 months ago

    I bought my 2.0 license in 2011. Penciling in 4.0 for 2023 :)

  • Nvorzula 9 months ago

    I took a dive away from Sublime Text over to Atom a few years ago because I was starting up some contract work, didn't want to pay for a copy, and didn't want to continue doing the hokey thing of using a friend's license for work purposes. So I got use to Atom just fine, plus the UI is nice.

    I mean, Atom is nice. The package management is all there and frequent updates are great, but...I don't write JS/HTML/CSS/PHP. I typically write Python, Go, Java, and heck even Prolog. Reading the changelog you can clearly see that they have a target audience, and I am not in it.

    On the performance side (you knew it was coming!) I am mostly fine except for opening a project directory. I swear Atom has a coded in `sleep` whenever you try to open a file explorer. At first, I thought that this was a cute little quirk that would disappear after an update one day. But that update never came.

    So I'll download Sublime again. Spend a morning to get it "just so" for, at the very least, Python and Go. I can easily see Sublime winning me back if I reinvest in it.

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    Kind of shocked that you weren't able to stomach the cost of Sublime as an independent contractor. Invest in your self!

  • beefhash 9 months ago

    Avoiding unnecessary costs is a solid business decision.

  • whalesalad 9 months ago

    There is the opportunity cost of transitioning to a different editor/tool. The second the individual got the 10th "Please Register!" dialog they should have just ponied up and factored it into business expense. Instead a few hours were likely wasted scouring the internet for tips and plugins and tools on how to configure Atom.

  • favadi 9 months ago

    Investing money to a tool that help your productivity is something should be considered as well.

  • sclangdon 9 months ago

    I'm always bemused by software developers who are unwilling to pay for software. Especially software they actually use.

    If software developers don't value software, there is something very wrong with our industry.

  • yoodenvranx 9 months ago

    > Especially software they actually use.

    And it's not even an expensive specialized software you just use once every few weeks. Sublime Text is literally the first program I start in the morning and the last one I close in the evening. I bought a license in 2011 or 2012 and have used it daily since then. And now I can upgrade for just $30? This is easily the best value-for-money of all the things I ever bought in my whole life

  • teddyh 9 months ago

    > If software developers don't value software, there is something very wrong with our industry.

    Oh, they value it, all right. They just don’t want to buy it, at least not in the customary fashion. They’re more than happy to pay for software using bug fixes, feature contributions, community engagement, or even their own software. Maybe, just maybe, software for software developers isn’t a good product to be sold the way software is usually sold?

  • criddell 9 months ago

    The developer giving free licenses to big contributors is a very solid plan. It's an inexpensive way to reward the most valuable members of your community and keeps them engaged.

    However, most people just use Sublime Text. If the software were expensive I probably wouldn't feel so strongly. Looking for and fixing bugs in Sublime Text would be a terrible use of my time. For many of us, $80 represents an hour or two of work.

  • Touche 9 months ago

    That's one way to look at it. I prefer to adjust to reality rather than hope to change reality to suit my preferences. If people don't like paying for software, then charging money for software is not something I'm going to waste my time on.

  • Nvorzula 9 months ago

    A lot of people are commenting on how cheapskate I was. Absolutely! I was still in undergraduate and this was my first contracting gig. I am older, wiser, and ahem richer now. =)

  • m_st 9 months ago

    Have a look at Visual Studio Code too. It's free and (in my experience) quicker than Atom.

    However, both VS Code and Atom stand no chance against ST regarding startup time. Thus I keep coming back to ST.

  • giancarlostoro 9 months ago

    I think for Python it's fine enough. I personally use PyCharm when performance isn't as much of a concern. You could give Anaconda a try:


    Though when I did Python I used one of the PEP8 plugins and the enhanced autocomplete plugin (soo highly recommend it).

    Also check out:


    A bit dated but some of those plugins are definitely worth it, especially Git Gutter.

  • cdnsteve 9 months ago

    PyCharm is crazy slow for me, I find I don't need 3/4 of the features in it.

  • giancarlostoro 9 months ago

    Personally used to the "slowness" of PyCharm, still think it's fast enough and doesn't get in my way too much. If I'm on a system that can't handle a full blown IDE something like Emacs w/ Spacemacs or Sublime Text 3 works for me. I'm not totally married to my tools, though I do use JetBrains software as much as I can. PyCharm has debugging tools and other things which I find useful, though I do agree, it does seem a bit overwhelming at first.

  • criddell 9 months ago

    It's discouraging to me that a tool that's excellent, actively developed, and inexpensive still can't get support from professional developers like yourself.

  • rootlocus 9 months ago

    Did you just write 3 paragraphs of Atom review on the sublime 3.0 release announcement?

  • hellofunk 9 months ago

    So what if he did? Any article and discussion about a code editor is going to inevitably inspire conversation and comparisons with other editors.

  • rootlocus 9 months ago

    The discussion sparked by it revolves around "don't be cheap" and "try visual studio code". Just like every other discussion about Atom, Sublime or Visual Studio Code.

  • adtac 9 months ago

    What's wrong with that? Atom aims to compete with Sublime and there's nothing wrong with a review comparing the two.

  • rootlocus 9 months ago

    Except for the fact that there's barely any comparison, and nothing new is mentioned. Atom is cool, slow and not every language is supported equally. Sublime costs money. Hardly warrants 4 total paragraphs where sublime is barely mentioned.

  • bmh_ca 9 months ago

    I second this. I meander back and forth between Sublime and Atom, for exactly this reason - Sublime is faster, but Atom has done some key things better (e.g. package management).

  • joncalhoun 9 months ago

    As someone who uses both editors daily, Atom is simply better for Go because of the plugins there. go-plus is amazing and its maintainers do a fantastic job.

    That said, ST is still significantly better for many other tasks and I end up using it daily, so you should definitely try it out. I'm just saying don't judge it solely on how well it handles Go because you may be disappointed coming from Atom.

  • donatj 9 months ago

    IMHO VSCode's official Microsoft emdorsed Go extension is unparalleled. Little bit of setup but well worth it.

  • hit8run 9 months ago

    Don't be so cheap. Sublime is worth every Dollar and if you use it professionally it is well spent.

  • arh68 9 months ago

    Note: if for some reason your b3126 doesn't work properly after running b3143, I found that deleting just the Packages folder from my data folder [0] was enough to get b3126 back to normal.

    [0] https://www.sublimetext.com/docs/3/revert.html

  • esolyt 9 months ago

    Sublime's startup time (even before 3.0) never failed to amaze me, especially compared to Atom and VSCode.

    And now it starts even faster.

  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    wow, congrats Jon and Will, this has been a long time coming. I can not think of more than maybe one other piece of software I gladly pay for and look forward to new releases.

    Also, Will: I apologize for being one of those assholes with a moderately popular plugin that still hasn't updated the thing to follow Package Control best practices.

    I'm sure you guys have discussed it somewhere in the past, but would you comment on where you see Sublime heading feature wise now that there is, arguably, some competition in the same general editor market (vs code, atom, etc...)? I don't like comparing stuff and saying "why can you just do that" but some of those editors, even with all their shortcomings, have massively benefited from good debugger support (vs code), and a pretty well though out set of features to support plugin developers (dependency management, testing, etc...).

  • gkya 9 months ago

    As an enthusiastic Emacs user I can say that Sublime Text is one of the best text editors out there, together with Emacs and Vi-family. I've only sporadically used it but it's really nice. If I was using my "text editor" only for text-editing (I use Emacs apps like Gnus, Elfeed and Org-mode, and really enjoy Elisp and the programmable environment it provides), I'd definitely use it.

    One thing that I don't understand is though, when I buy ST, what do I buy? I've only seen others use full versions but as far as I can tell it's only the [UNREGISTERED] bit in the titlebar and the random "please buy me" popup. It's understandable that one would pay merely to sustain its development but is there any actual differences?

  • kmin93 9 months ago

    With a license, you get access to the dev builds[0].

    Most, if not all, of the new features of the 3.0 release were present in the latest dev version (the dev builds get updated much more frequently, as opposed to the public build, which was last updated Sep 2016).

    [0] https://www.sublimetext.com/3dev

  • kronos29296 9 months ago

    You just don't have that pop up anymore and also get the satisfaction of having supported the devs behind sublime text. Nuf said.

  • emh68 9 months ago

    ST is the only editor with non-insane indentation controls: it's right there at the bottom of the window (want to start using 4-space indent in a JS file in the middle of a project full of C++ code that's tab indented? In a project where some C++ devs wrote 4-space indebted JS, when you normally prefer 2, but what to stay consistent? No problem, it's a click away). IntelliJ enforces per-language indentation (what if you have multiple projects with 2 or 4 space indent? Tough luck) and IIRC Atom requires you to download a barely-maintained plugin just to get something even resembling indentation control (and you have to edit a config file to change it - on the fly this ain't!)

  • Flimm 9 months ago

    Using a .editorconfig file solves this problem in many text editors. http://editorconfig.org

  • cedricium 9 months ago

    Brackets has it the same way as ST: bottom-right of the screen you can switch between spaces and tabs as well as the number to insert with each tab press.

  • crispinb 9 months ago

    > IntelliJ enforces per-language indentation (what if you have multiple projects with 2 or 4 space indent? Tough luck)

    Not the case. You can set it to match existing file indents if you wish (with a notification when an indent style is matched). And you can have individual project-scoped or multiple IDE-scoped language code style presets.

  • 0xelectron 9 months ago

    Have you used vscode?

  • longsangstan 9 months ago

    I love Sublime. Tried Atom, but too slow on my 2012 Macbook Air.

    One question: How is sublime sustainable economically? I mean alternatives like Atom is free & open source, supported by a big company. With a infinite free trial model, how can sublime survive?

  • JohnBooty 9 months ago

    The "infinite free trial" model surely helps them indirectly. It expands the user base, which expands the plugin ecosystem, which sells licenses... because when you choose a text editor, you're choosing it for the ecosystem as much as for the editor itself.

    There are AFAIK only two full-time employees (Jon Skinner and Will Bond) so they don't need to sell a ton of licenses.

    If they sell 6,000 licenses a year that nets them nearly $500K/year in revenue.

    Please note that the "6,000" there was totally invented by me. I just estimated how many licenses they need to sell to reach half a mil. I don't know if they sell 1,000 a year or 100,000 a year... I'd be really curious to know how many they sell.

  • nkkollaw 9 months ago

    Many people buy it. It's expensive, too...

  • sleepyhead 9 months ago

    It's cheap. I use it ten hours every day. It costs less than I would charge for an hour of consulting. Ok so I do live in one of the most expensive countries in the world but even in a developing country a developer don't have to work long to pay for this license for a tool they would use a lot every day.

  • nkkollaw 9 months ago

    It's not cheap compared to other software, and not cheap compared to most text editors and even most IDEs.

    I didn't say it's not worth it, I said it's not cheap. It's not.

  • sleepyhead 9 months ago

    Less than one hour working time for the core software used when developing is cheap.

    A lot of software is very under priced in terms of value. The App Store and SaaS copycats pricing doesn't reflect the value or the cost of software - you need big volumes and many go bust due to no profits.

    I paid for ST2 in 2012. Five years later the upgrade price is only $30. Should have been more.

  • ericthor 9 months ago

    Can any active users comment on the package ecosystem. Active? Running into any problems?

  • oAlbe 9 months ago

    Very active. I use a fair share of them, and they are updated regularly.

    On the rare occasion that something breaks (Seti_UI theme, mostly. But to be fair, I installed it when it wasn't stable yet), fixes are often published the next day or at most in the next handful of days. In the meantime you can just disable a plugin and go ahead. But again, it happened rarely to me.

    The only problem (that I'm aware of, correct me if I'm wrong) they ran into was the whole deal with Kite basically paying some plugin devs to hide spyware into their code. But that has been handled and solved, and lead to the creation of basic guidelines for plugin developments and extensive discussion of the forum. Devs were very responsive.

  • tarikjn 9 months ago

    I have used Sublime for many years, but had to switch to Atom for a large mono-repo codebase, because there is no decent plugin on Sublime to exclude Git-ignored files from search. The only one available froze my computer every minute.

  • funkjunky 9 months ago

    Just adding my voice to the chorus of users that love sublime text so much that we are begging you to take more of our money. I cannot live or function without it, I use it for everything I do.

    Discovering sublime text was crucial to my early development as a programmer, I can easily see myself losing interest in it without having such a powerful, efficient, intuitive, and FUN tool at my fingertips. Yeah I said it: fun. Sublime text is fun for me. I even type my emails and web form responses in it, just because.

    Anyway, congrats on the release, I love sublime text, you already have my money but seriously, I'll give you more

  • Yaggo 9 months ago

    Unfortunately the macOS version still has really annoying issue for virtual desktop users: the editor windows are not restored to their previous virtual desktops after restart/reboot. Instead, all windows will open on the current desktop.

    If you wish this to be fixed, please comment the related forum post: https://forum.sublimetext.com/t/macos-window-restoration-to-...

  • gespadas 9 months ago

    Finally! Congrats devs! :-)

  • gapo 9 months ago

    I think Sublime is a great editor.

    I enjoy a lot of the nice UI based workflows Sublime provides - but always felt that mastering VIM / emacs would provide me a far better pay out. Does any body else agree ?

  • criddell 9 months ago

    I disagree. Maybe you might be marginally better off, but if you enjoy Sublime more, that matters.

    If you are going for mastery level, that implies you would also learn Sublime's programming model inside and out. If you get to that level of expertise, you are probably going to be more efficient than most when it comes to editing text.

    If you are going to be using one of those editors a lot anyway (because you will be ssh'ing into a Linux machine or rely on org-mode, for example), then perhaps that would shift the landscape.

  • zapperdapper 9 months ago

    I used to use graphical editors. I used PFE if anyone remembers that and then PSPad. PFE and PSPad were windows only which turned out to be an issue. I then switched to JEdit, but found that a number of plugins had issues and connecting to get a plugin just didn't work on many occasions.

    About ten years ago I got a job that required me to edit multiple languages on multiple platforms and I was using about three different editors: Oxygen XML, Eclipse, VS, Python Charm and I just thought this is getting ridiculous. I switched to Emacs because it is cross-platform, fast, and you can edit any kind of file in it. I never looked back. I have edited about a dozen programming languages in it, and used it for markdown, and DocBook and DITA XML editing. Today I am still happily using it. On my latest gig I had to edit TeX - no problem in Emacs. I learn new tricks in it all the time. I have a colour scheme that works really well. Having built in ansi-term and being able to do M-! and then run a shell command save a lot of time in the workflow. There are thousands of features and tweaks you can do. The incremental forward and back search is lightning fast. I use C-r a lot in Bash too. On the whole I'm very pleased with my switch to Emacs. By the way I usually only use the text-only version of Emacs (emacs-nox on Linux). I do keep a copy of AquaMacs installed on my Mac too, but work mostly on the command line.

    I did actually try Sublime a few years back and have a licence, but I found myself just firing up Emacs on the command line and C-x C-f to fast load a file more often than not.

    I would say, yes, go for Vim or Emacs, but it depends really what you need from an editor.

  • ctw 9 months ago

    Why not both? Sublime (and pretty much every other popular editor I've used) has a "vim mode" (Sublime calls it vintage mode). Sublime's is built in and available right in out of the box, you just need to enable it. I've been using this setup for years. It's the best of both worlds, you get all of the plug-ins, UI, and commands from Sublime while still getting to use vim's commands when just plain editing text. There's no reason I would ever go back to just one or the other.

  • sleepychu 9 months ago

    I have sublime installed for double clicking on text files now and then but I doubt I'll upgrade (I never really found it good enough to be an IDE and for plain text I can't beat VIM)

    One of the things that I love about VIM is that because I use very few plugins I can edit text just as efficiently on any remote machine without complicated plugin installation.

    I need to install VIM style movement in whatever IDE I use (IntelliJ these days) because otherwise I find moving around the text painfully slow.

  • Koshkin 9 months ago

    Sublime, vim and emacs are three different animals. It does pay to know the basics of the latter two, especially if you expect to have to edit files from the console and/or find yourself using a random UNIX environment (which most likely will not have Sublime installed on it).

  • chimprich 9 months ago

    I haven't used Sublime much but I get the impression I'm far faster in Emacs than work colleagues etc. are in Sublime or the latest flavour of IDE. That is after at least a decade and a half of learning and configuring Emacs to my preferences though.

    At least part of that efficiency (apart from Emacs being awesome) is that I've been able to keep getting better at using my editor rather than having to change tools every so often as less configurable editors get overtaken by ones with new features.

    Emacs is pretty deep (I keep discovering new things) and configurable in the extreme. I think it's very likely that it will last for decades yet - any killer innovation that another editor comes up with is likely to be quickly copied into Emacs.

  • chimprich 9 months ago

    Downvoted by a vi fan?

  • tmerr 9 months ago

    There is a neovim plugin for sublime if you want to benefit from both fancy hotkeys and the minimap / other IDE-ish niceities

  • reimertz 9 months ago

    These news was a good reminder that I still used the trial version of the app. I somehow managed to getting used to all those "on-save reminder" you'd get every now and then.

    Just bought it.

  • brad0 9 months ago

    Thanks guys for a solid piece of software.

    After using ST for five years I felt like I should probably purchase a licence :) I feel guilty for not doing it sooner.

  • ghostbrainalpha 9 months ago

    Sublime is so good, I just started using it to replace my Note Pad app for non-dev related stuff. For example shopping lists, meeting notes, and to do lists.

    I found it was just easier to have one app to do everything.

    Even though I don't have certain nice text formatting features, I use Code Comments to make certain lines distinct.

    That's how you know you LOVE a product, when you still prefer to use it even for things it isn't designed for.

  • vijaybritto 9 months ago

    I was wondering in the afternoon about when the next sublime would be released and what it would contain. Flabbergasted to see it trending no 1 in HN!!

  • NuSkooler 9 months ago

    Thank you for your hard work! THIS is the editor I use on Windows, Linux, and OS X. You will not find a box that I work on without Sublime running.

  • donatj 9 months ago

    I use Sublime mostly for large files and it's awesomly quick and useful search. I've switched to VSCode for most other tasks however.

  • mathnode 9 months ago

    I moved from Vim to ST around 2012, I missed the textmate hype, and never looked back.

    Since then it has been my main editor, cross platform for php, then python, then ruby, to java (...yup), and now clojure and racket. And of course all the SQL, shell scripts, and config file munging in between.

    Maybe one day I will learn emacs, but for the meantime I am happy and productive.

  • wnevets 9 months ago

    > Startup is faster, opening files is faster, and scrolling is more efficient.

    This is a big reason why I still use sublime over atom.

  • punnerud 9 months ago

    I don't like the Touch Bar support in the way they made in. How to disable: https://stackoverflow.com/questions/46218557/how-to-disable-...

  • OutsmartDan 9 months ago

    Amazing, I don't think i've ever used "beta" products for so long. Glad it's finally official!

  • jrimbault 9 months ago

    I think I played Minecraft just before it went into beta and stopped playing it when it "came out". I don't know how long that was, but Sublime Text 3 beta certainly felt even longer.

    edit: correction, the beta of minecraft lasted only a year, so it definitely felt longer to me. Weird memory tricks eh.

  • ejolto 9 months ago

    I was going to say maybe you mixed up the alpha and beta version, but turns out Minecraft was only in alpha for six months. Weird, felt much longer for me too.

  • mattl 9 months ago


  • OutsmartDan 9 months ago

    True; though the life cycles on update seemed much more frequent on Gmail vs ST3.

  • erikb 9 months ago

    Reading the article it feels like they raised the major number for no reason. But actually if they changed the API a lot and have rewritten parts, then it's really valid. Maybe they should hire a real marketing person, or at least pay for some marketing consulting here and there.

  • johnmc408 9 months ago

    Do they support "virtual cursor" yet? (that is where you can move the cursor up/down/left/right over "empty" space and not have the cursor "hug" the text...I really miss this feature and didn't see it in Sublime or VSCode (never tried Atom)

  • old_chap 9 months ago

    As a try-hard wanna be-learning-programmer. ST leaves me very satisfied and very thankful for the autocomplete feature (im sure more experienced programmers can see the flaws here though).

    I work in XML and SQL in my everyday work activities and its highlighting features are stupid good.

  • sercand 9 months ago

    This week SourceTree also changed its icon, two favorite developer tool icon changes confuse me all day.

  • AJRF 9 months ago

    Is Sublime super good for webdev or something? Does it have a bunch of indespensible plugins for webdev? I cant see upside when comparing it to Vim, but I see lots and lots of folks rave about it so im willing to admit I’m wrong but would like to know why people love it so much.

  • defrex 9 months ago

    For me the killer feature of ST is multiple cursors. Despite being relatively fluent in vim, that one feature has always prevented me from switching.

  • AJRF 9 months ago

    Are "multiple cursors" in ST the same as "visual blocks" in Vim?

  • elnygren 9 months ago

    Visual mode is slow and awkward compared to what ST can do with cmd+D, for example.

    IME, vim actually loses in performance too when editing multiple lines.

  • jokoon 9 months ago

    A little late to the party, but I'm glad to see folding code doesn't happen at a new line.

    Although there is still no blinking block caret. The size can be changed but it's a solid color, not transparent.

    Also I wonder if I could change the background color of the brace matching highlight.

  • cunningfatalist 9 months ago

    I switched to JetBrains IDEs quite some time ago, but Sublime is still my favorite scratchpad. What make sublime so much better than other editors is how fast and usable it is. I don't want it to be as fancy as VSCode, I just want it to be fast.

  • faaq 9 months ago

    What theme Are They using in the screen-capture [0] of sublime text?

    [0] - https://www.sublimetext.com/screenshots/3.0/linux.png

  • wbond 9 months ago

    That is the new Default theme with the Mariana color scheme.

  • faaq 9 months ago

    Thanks you!

  • 9 months ago
  • dsego 9 months ago

    If anybody is looking for a more "pro" ui theme, try monokai.pro/sublime-text. You have to buy a license though. It's actually made by the same guy who created the original monokai theme. There is a vscode version as well.

  • woodrowbarlow 9 months ago

    what does a "pro ui theme" even mean?

  • dsego 9 months ago

    More elegant, discrete, well-thought-out, carefully crafted, developed with design rigor?

  • xs 9 months ago

    Is there an option to print yet?

  • davidu 9 months ago

    Not easy for an editor to support. There are much better tools available to print code or reflow plaintext into a .ps or .pdf.

    Enscript[1] is my (the?) preferred way and a plugin would be a fine tay to achieve this. Will format code in almost any way you could ever imagine.

    1: https://www.gnu.org/software/enscript/

  • macksol 9 months ago

    Can't imaging going back to Sublime after switching to VS Code a few months ago.

  • cdnsteve 9 months ago

    Does anyone knowledge of what version 3 is written in, still C++ as version 2? https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=2822114

  • roystonvassey 9 months ago

    As someone who greatly under-utilizes Sublime, I'm still amazed at the ease with which it handles crazy, large files. I never even notice it until someone remarks on how I'm able to open a ~20 Mb file without hassle.

  • pvg 9 months ago

    This might be more of a function of some of the more broken Electron editors. Any sane editor can open a 20 Mb file without hassle. Notepad and TextEdit can.

  • shouldgowork 9 months ago

    But it's not that great at several GB :(

  • ch8230 9 months ago

    I'd guess most editors do. Have you found an editor that doesn't?

  • dotancohen 9 months ago

    I open multi-GB files often enough in VIM. Just make sure that you've disabled any plugins, as _those_ will often crush under large files. The `-u NONE` option will disable `.vimrc` and thus all plugins as well.

    See relevant discussion on Stack Exchange: https://unix.stackexchange.com/questions/139254/why-cant-vim...

  • lurker- 9 months ago

    Windows have EmEditor.. unfortunately Linux doesn't seem to have any. Hopefully someone can develop a great frontend for the xi editor (https://github.com/google/xi-editor).

    Sublime Text is imo near perfect, only thing I miss is the ability to edit multi-GB files (on a reasonably priced laptop).. sadly I believe it will be near impossible for Sublime Text to ever support this.

  • holydude 9 months ago

    Emacs with vlf can open very large files by splitting them in chunks. Quiet useful.

  • jokoon 9 months ago

    It's even faster than before... Atom has more catching up to do...

  • norswap 9 months ago

    How learnable is Sublime?

    - Is there a way to lookup documentation while using the editor (contextual help)?

    - Is there a way to access most features without key bindings and to learn the key bindings while doing so?

  • vkanko 9 months ago

    One of the best software purchases i have done. But damned be me for purchasing it 25th of Jan and not qualifying for free upgrade. Oh well, the upgrade price isn't that bad.

  • speleding 9 months ago

    It's just $11 to upgrade from version 2... that's a steal

  • kahlonel 9 months ago

    I've been a loyal user of Sublime until a few years ago when I switched to Vim. Still have this beauty in my computer because of how happily it handles large files <3

  • skinnymuch 9 months ago

    For people on Mac, which plugins make Sublime better than current Textmate? I've never switched from it just because, but wouldn't mind switching or paying.

  • koenpunt 9 months ago

    I you care about a decent file manager in your editor, nothing tops TextMate 2. For me that at least is one of the reasons I'm still using TextMate. Although it's sad to see that a lot of bundles move away from the TextMate format, but are continued to be developed for Sublime, Atom, VSCode, etc...

  • bsimpson 9 months ago

    SublimeGit is fantastic. Incremental find (I think it's Ctrl+D) is like multicursor, but it selects the next occurrence of a string, so the cursors don't have to be on adjacent lines. It's been so long since I've used TextMate that I don't remember all the differences, but those two alone are worth switching for.

    I also have SidebarEnhancements, Calculate, Alignment, EditorConfig, and Default File Type installed. None of them make a major impact, but they all make the experience a tad nicer.

  • skinnymuch 9 months ago

    Thanks. I don't think it has incremental find. Just same point in lines but I'm not sure.

  • nik736 9 months ago

    Does Sublime come with a Git integration like Atom does?

  • azeirah 9 months ago

    There are Git plugins, but Git is not integrated into Sublime itself. There are many many Git plugins though, all great ones :)

  • rebolyte 9 months ago

    I've found GitSavvy to work quite well: https://packagecontrol.io/packages/GitSavvy

  • dsego 9 months ago

    GitSavvy + GitGutter + GitCommitMsg

  • DarkCrusader2 9 months ago

    I have been using gitsavvy and it is really good.

  • saikatsg 9 months ago

    Looks like the download page has not been updated. It still says - "Sublime Text 3 is currently in beta. The latest build is 3126"

  • lowsenberg 9 months ago

    I don't know how often I type 'subl3 -n' every day. One of my all-time favorite tools. I'm happy to pay for the upgrade.

  • willcodeforfoo 9 months ago

    Long-time ST2 and ST3 user. I think I've more or less moved to VS Code but wanted to chime in: Great website! And loads super fast.

  • dna_polymerase 9 months ago

    I just updated my Sublime and switched to the new layout. Woa! Once again I'm happy I invested in this beautiful piece of software!

  • mcemilg 9 months ago

    What is the message behind the showing tensorflow cpp codes on the update image? Even cpp programmers can code on the Sublime Text?

  • skybrian 9 months ago

    I'm curious how the language support works? There is apparently a plugin for language server protocol, but it's in beta.

  • frou_dh 9 months ago

    In stock form, Sublime does not have much "real" knowledge of the code. The syntax highlighting and autocompletion are powered off of surface-level text analysis rather than any hooks into toolchains.

    There are numerous 3rd party packages to improve on this for specific languages. Hopefully the Language Server effort takes off and reduces the rampant duplication of effort between them.

  • wintorez 9 months ago

    No matter how many other editors or IDEs I tried, I always went back to Sublime. It's much faster than Atom, VSCode, etc.

  • ntrepid8 9 months ago

    I love it! Sublime Text is an excellent editor and I use it every day. It's worth every penny for a paid license.

  • noncoml 9 months ago

    I bought a Sublime license about 2 years ago and to my surprise it is valid for 3.0 as well! Thanks Sublime folks!

  • undoware 9 months ago

    Has anyone tried both Sublime Text 3 and Atom 1.20? I'd love to see a compare/contrast

  • aarbor989 9 months ago

    I casually switched to Atom for a week or two and although i think it looks a lot prettier out of the box, it just feels HEAVY. Launching can take awhile and it freezes up a decent amount. I've also seen it suck up quite a bit of memory at times. Atom has made some strides in the past couple releases but I'll be sticking to Sublime for the time being.

  • mundanevoice 9 months ago

    Thanks for building a great editor that just works and is fast enough. It has the lowest barrier to entry and is mostly free due to unlimited trial. 5 years ago, when I started writing code professionally, Sublime made things so easy because I didn't have to learn an IDE to write code.

    Many kudos and one day I will definitely buy a LICENSE.

  • fastball 9 months ago

    You don't make enough after 5 years as a coder to justify an $80 expense?

  • mundanevoice 9 months ago

    I make enough to buy any damn License I want. I never said it was not justified. I don't use Sublime these days. I had fond memories of starting with Sublime and so I said and for the nostalgia sake, I will fucking buy the license as well. So stop assuming things and judging people, alright?

  • PopsiclePete 9 months ago

    my second fav. text editor after vs code. I gotta say tho, VS Code did get the plugin story better - they don't seem to clash/conflict with each other and with global settings the way they did (for me at least) with sublime.

  • nkkollaw 9 months ago

    Touchbar support? Does it still sort files in the tree view with folders first on Mac?

  • macksol 9 months ago

    Can't imagine going back to Sublime after switching to VS Code a few months ago.

  • IshV 9 months ago

    Is it just me or does the new logo look a lot like Winamp's logo?

  • EGreg 9 months ago

    Just curious, how would this Sublime compare to the latest TextMate?

  • beamatronic 9 months ago

    Does it support printing?

  • pjmlp 9 months ago

    Congratulations on the release, getting a new license later on.

  • jasonrhaas 9 months ago

    Woo hoo! I love ST. I think the biggest thing lacking now is a solid package manager. I like how on VSCode and Atom you can kind of see the "stars" or popularity of the package before you install it.

  • SippinLean 9 months ago

    Still no way to learn about the extensions from within the editor itself. VSCode has the edge here, this is one of those things that really makes sense to have a UI for (beyond ST's Command Palette)

  • daok 9 months ago

    I don't understand that a product oriented for software engineer use sentence like "Significantly improved startup time" instead of real numbers. What does that mean "significantly"? 10%...50%?

  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    like lots of software, a lot of that can depend on plugins, themes, how many buffers are getting re-opened from the previous editor state, etc.... I imagine it makes it hard to produce meaningful numbers outside of extremely controlled test cases, and might be misleading to some people.

  • mariusmg 9 months ago

    > I imagine it makes it hard to produce

    They should just compare the startup time of stock versions of 2 and 3 and post those.

  • jdc0589 9 months ago

    That would probably be a good middle ground. You will still get people saying "what the hell, mine take 3 seconds to start up with 10000 plugins and 20 1MB files open, but you say 350ms?" But, can't please everyone.

  • codefined 9 months ago

    I think values like that are more often used by advertisers, instead of software engineers honestly. It's incredibly tricky to measure the increase of start-up time as a percentage since it matters so much on hardware, what files you have open, if it's cached, etc.

    Using a single percentage would probably be more misleading than just saying "significantly improved".

  • betadreamer 9 months ago

    can you guys share what you LOVE about sublime? I mostly just use it as regular editor with Command P to open other files. I know I can do more than this...

  • m1keil 9 months ago

    - CMD + Shift + P for command platter - Column select - Speed

  • Phenix88be 9 months ago

    Too late ! I m a spacemacs user now !

    Seriously, this release took ages...

  • keypress 9 months ago

    Is it open source?

  • ddingus 9 months ago

    I love this program. Will buy another license.

    Thank you for it.

  • whipoodle 9 months ago

    Best editor out there. Congrats!

  • ijafri 9 months ago

    wow!! just ended my evaluation with this release and purchased the license...

  • norswap 9 months ago

    Why Sublime over other text editors or IDEs?

    What are the deep conceptual differences, the strongly held opinions?

  • saikatsg 9 months ago

    Finally it has arrived :)

  • peteretep 9 months ago

    Linux finally has a decent text editor!

  • typon 9 months ago

    Vim has been on Linux for years now

  • nf05papsjfVbc 9 months ago

    and emacs (I use both) but not everyone is able to see how good they are, unfortunately.

  • mollusk 9 months ago

    Just curious, how can you use both? Isn't muscle memory an obstacle when switching between them?

  • nf05papsjfVbc 9 months ago

    I mostly use emacs (having moved to it relatively recently) but fall back to vim when editing/viewing a small single file. On the odd occasion I do hit the wrong keys from misplaced muscle memory (and in vim a bunch of things could happen quickly) but usually I still have the Vim muscle memory and can manage. My main driver is emacs though.

  • dagenleg 9 months ago

    I also use both and I found that keybindings and interaction with text are so different that it almost does not hurt. What I found much harder is using vim-like modes in editors - they almost match the vim keybindings but not just quite, luring you into the sense of familiarity but betraying at the most critical moment.

    The only thing I've had to do was to map <C-x><C-s> in vim to ":w".

  • Johnny_Brahms 9 months ago

    Some People use evil, which is hands down the best vim emulation out there.

    I myself started with evil after a long time with vi(m) and then made the switch to a more "pure" (for the lack of a better word) Emacs experience.

    I am still very proficient with vim, even though Emacs has been my daily driver for 4 years.

  • yaantc 9 months ago

    Evil (Extensible VI Layer for emacs) is one way to go. I've heard it's pretty good, although I don't use it myself (native emacs).


  • pritambaral 9 months ago

    You can use vim keybindings in emacs. Check out evil-mode.

  • awestroke 9 months ago

    How about vim, emacs, vscode, atom, even sublime 3 beta?

  • m6g6a 9 months ago


  • Jeaye 9 months ago

    Is it still proprietary nagware?

  • nolepointer 9 months ago

    Does anyone else see the old icon when pinned to the taskbar?

  • max23_ 9 months ago

    Same here after the update. Just do a restart and you should see the new icon in the taskbar.

  • anderber 9 months ago

    Yeah, I just removed it and pinned it again.

  • khana 9 months ago


  • 11235813213455 9 months ago

    Can we finally drag selected text on Linux?

  • jenkijo 9 months ago

    Oh shit! It come back

  • jrimbault 9 months ago
  • azeirah 9 months ago

    It never left, they are very active on their own forums and push updates every few weeks. Essential software for my workflow, super stable

  • matthew349hall 9 months ago

    I really need to buy a license and stop floating on the trial someday. I depend on sublime so much.

  • paultopia 9 months ago

    It came out of beta? It came out of beta!!1!11111

  • jgh 9 months ago

    is everyone just going to ignore that awful tab bar at the top?

  • iotku 9 months ago

    Considering that if you really dislike it you can apply a different theme in about 10 seconds, probably.

    Personally I'm not too big of a fan of the styling there, but it's far from a critical issue.

  • 9 months ago